Questions regarding the "Hound Archon" and "Mirror of Opposition"

Silver Moon · Apr 18, 2004

Hi, I'm currently running a sequel to the "Beast of Burden" module from Dungeon #100. When we did that module the evil Hound Archon who had been created via a Mirror of Opposition escaped at the end (and took the mirror with him). However, in researching both the race and item for the current module I'm coming up with several questions and some possible inconsistencies with the plot from the original module.

1. The module indicated that the evil hound archon had destroyed the good one, however on page 222 of the DMG under the item description it says that "Upon the defeat or destruction of either the duplicate or the original the duplicate and her items disappear completely." So why is the evil archon still around?

2. If a hound archon is a celestial, then even if it were destroyed on the prime material plane wouldn't it still survive on its home plane? (the Seven Heavens or some other LG plane of existence?) And if so, wouldn't it seek to end the existence of the evil one? I ask because the current module has two rather powerful LG clerics in the adventuring party.

3. Regarding the mirror - this is one hell of a powerful item if it can duplicate immortal beings and artifacts. Sure, the "defeat or destroy" aspect makes the duplicate temporary, but in the event of a stalemate wouldn't this leave both in existence? And why would the evil duplicate even want to defeat or destroy the other if they knew it would cause them to cease to exist?

4. Lastly, the implication is that duplicate is of the opposite alignment of the person, but one of the party members on the mission is a true neutral druid. If they are exposed to the mirror what alignment would the duplicate be?

AGGEMAM · Apr 18, 2004

1. You answer your own question here in question 2, since the evil effectively banished the good aligned original to it's home plane both are still alive.

2. I bet it will! (and see above)

(EDIT: And if can't find another way, it might resort to suicide, which very effectively will kill them both).

3. Yes, and no. But in this particular case the evil one knows that whoever wins, both will still remain in existance as long as one or the other is not destroyed on it's home plane.

4. Well, I'd use the Helm of Opposite Alignment description on that, which is particulary nasty for a druid.

SRD said:
Helm of Opposite Alignment: ... On a failed save, the alignment of the wearer is radically altered to an alignment as different as possible from the former alignment—good to evil, chaotic to lawful, neutral to some extreme commitment (LE, LG, CE, or CG).

Silver Moon · Apr 18, 2004

AGGEMAM said:
1. You answer your own question here in question 2, since the evil effectively banished the good aligned original to it's home plane both are still alive.

Yeah, I had thought that except that the description said "defeat" which clearly did happen in the original encounter between the archons.

A few more thoughts while I'm on the subject.

5. Any suggestions as to how would the evil archon have the mirror set up? He'd clearly want to nearby to use on his enemies, but it is way too dangerous for him to just leave sitting around for just anyone to walk in front of.

6. Mirrors tend to be rather fragile, but given the power this one has I'd think it should have some sort of magical protections, otherwise one well placed missile destroys it. What protections would you suggest?

AGGEMAM · Apr 18, 2004

Silver Moon said:
Yeah, I had thought that except that the description said "defeat" which clearly did happen in the original encounter between the archons.

I haven't read the description in full so I can't phantom what loophole WotC applied in this case.

5. Oh, I thought it'd make a nice trap

6. Well, does it say it's made of glass. Couldn't it be made of any material really? It's the magic that makes it reflective, not nes'ry the material. In any case, in 2ed there was a 8th level Wizard spell called Glassteel that made glass as strong as steel, maybe a 3.5ed version of that spell was used.

Hypersmurf · Apr 19, 2004

AGGEMAM said:
I haven't read the description in full so I can't phantom what loophole WotC applied in this case.

At a guess - "At the defeat of the duplicate or the original? ... oh. Oops."

-Hyp.

AuraSeer · Apr 19, 2004

IMO it's clear that the adventure's description does not jibe with the way a Mirror Of Opposition works. Rather than try to alter the backstory or the standard item, I just ruled that the archon has a special mirror, more powerful than the regular version.

This "Greater Mirror of Opposition" is a minor artifact which can duplicate any creature that has no divine rank. Only one double can be active at a time. If the original creature is slain (not just banished), it cannot be raised or resurrected as long as the duplicate exists. Once a copy is slain, it is dead forever, and the mirror can be used again; however, each time this happens, there is a 10% chance that the item shatters irreparably. Unlike the ordinary wondrous item, the artifact version is usable a maximum of once per week.

This version fits the plot device from the published adventure, without being any more powerful as an offensive weapon for PCs.

Steve Jung · Apr 20, 2004

Silver Moon said:
/snip/
5. Any suggestions as to how would the evil archon have the mirror set up? He'd clearly want to nearby to use on his enemies, but it is way too dangerous for him to just leave sitting around for just anyone to walk in front of.

Put a cloth over it or a curtain in front of it. Curtain would be quicker.

Silver Moon said:
6. Mirrors tend to be rather fragile, but given the power this one has I'd think it should have some sort of magical protections, otherwise one well placed missile destroys it. What protections would you suggest?

Magic of Faerûn has a 6th-level sorcerer/wizard spell, Hardening. It increases the hardness of an object by 1 for every 2 caster levels.

allenw · Apr 20, 2004

Silver Moon said:
2. If a hound archon is a celestial, then even if it were destroyed on the prime material plane wouldn't it still survive on its home plane? (the Seven Heavens or some other LG plane of existence?)

Not unless the hound archon were only there due to a Conjuration(summoning) spell, such as Monster Summoning (I don't have the adventure in question, but this seems unlikely from context). Per the rules as written, any Called, Gated, Planar Allied, Planar Bound, Plane Shifted, etc. outsider is no-fooling, D-E-D dead if killed, just like ordinary folks (except much harder to bring back).

Silver Moon · Apr 21, 2004

AuraSeer said:
This "Greater Mirror of Opposition" is a minor artifact which can duplicate any creature that has no divine rank. Only one double can be active at a time. If the original creature is slain (not just banished), it cannot be raised or resurrected as long as the duplicate exists. Once a copy is slain, it is dead forever, and the mirror can be used again; however, each time this happens, there is a 10% chance that the item shatters irreparably. Unlike the ordinary wondrous item, the artifact version is usable a maximum of once per week. This version fits the plot device from the published adventure, without being any more powerful as an offensive weapon for PCs.

Great! Love it. I think I'll be combining many things pointed out in this thread, starting with this item. I think I'll change the "only one double can be active at a time" though, as the mirror is way too fun an item for me to use as a trap for a PC. I think the once-a-week restriction is enough to keep the item from over-abuse.

Silver Moon · Apr 24, 2004

Steve Jung said:
Magic of Faerûn has a 6th-level sorcerer/wizard spell, Hardening. It increases the hardness of an object by 1 for every 2 caster levels.

Great, between that and the Glass-steel spell I think the object will be sufficiently protected.