Nentir Vale Coming to Dungeons and Dragons

I’m glad to hear it had fans, I just wasn’t one of them, because to me it was TOO generic and customizable - I never saw anything distinguishing to me, and I think my distaste for the Primordial War multiverse reshuffling was part of it. This whole thing about “extremely dangerous world” is new to me, because despite all the talk at the time about “points of light”, I just couldn’t see it, it seemed too simplistic at the time, perhaps also due to a real campaign setting for detailing any of this. If he plays up this “whole world is trying to kill you” aspect, I can dig it a little better.

Then again, if they want a “whole world is trying to kill you” vibe, Athas would have fit better - you can’t even scrape enough metal together to make a spear tip, and even the plants are psionic carnivores... :eek:

Can I ask fans of Nentir Vale what features and themes really stood out to them back when it was a thing for 4e?

It wasn't so much about how the entire world was out to kill you, but that going outside the cities and towns was dangerous. Bandits, wild animals, etc.

I loved the Raven Queen - a former mortal that overthrew the previous (evil) god of death and took over his mantle without being evil or endorsing undead. I'm not so much a fan of the Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes version of her.

I liked that it had its own flavor - tieflings and dragonborn as core races, the former empires of Bael Turath and Arkhosia, new deities - but it was just vague enough that it didn't feel like you were locked in to a ton of lore as a DM.

Torog, the God who Crawls made the Underdark as the tunnels he crawled through, rather than just "ehhh, there are hundreds of miles of caves for reasons."

It just felt like a great starting point. Playing in other settings can sometimes feel a bit constrained, what with all the books and lore and detail.
 

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dave2008

Legend
...and I think my distaste for the Primordial War multiverse reshuffling was part of it.

That was my favorite part! The primordials and the Dawn War is what brought me and my group back to D&D. We never got into 2e or 3e, but the Dawn War made so much sense to us. The whole pantheon was so clean compared to the great wheel with multitudes of overlapping gods in other settings. We enjoyed it so much, we brought it into our 5e game.
 
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It sounds rather like the setting for the Grim Dawn computer game (which is no bad thing).

I think it highlights the point that any published setting becomes a homebrew setting as soon as a DM gets their hands on it. The Nentir Vale played at one table can be very different to the Nentir Vale played on the next.
 

TwoSix

Dirty, realism-hating munchkin powergamer
I feel like 2e Darksun fans who hate 4e Darksun don’t get this kind of pushback for their personal preference for the original version of their setting. Or Realms fans for hating 4e FR. Like, I’m not trying to start a petition to stop Mearls from doing his stream or anything, I’m just expressing being conflicted about a setting I like returning, but changed in a way I don’t like. It’s not as if that’s at all unusual in this hobby. But, I guess 4e fans don’t get to express our opinions. We’re all just objectively wrong about everything and should know to keep our wrong opinions to ourselves.
Well, people who hate 4e Darksun are also objectively wrong. 4e Darksun > 2e Darksun.
 

SkidAce

Legend
Supporter
Well, people who hate 4e Darksun are also objectively wrong. 4e Darksun > 2e Darksun.

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I feel like 2e Darksun fans who hate 4e Darksun don’t get this kind of pushback for their personal preference for the original version of their setting. Or Realms fans for hating 4e FR. Like, I’m not trying to start a petition to stop Mearls from doing his stream or anything, I’m just expressing being conflicted about a setting I like returning, but changed in a way I don’t like. It’s not as if that’s at all unusual in this hobby. But, I guess 4e fans don’t get to express our opinions. We’re all just objectively wrong about everything and should know to keep our wrong opinions to ourselves.
This would b a valid concern IF the setting were being officially published in this state. If the changes were being presented as canonical and an official update of the setting.

But so far that does not seem to be the case. It’s effectively a homgame. Is he not allowed to make changes for his home game? Why can’t he tell the stories he wants in a setting that does what he want?

Getting upset about what he is doing to the setting feels a little like getting upset over what Chris Perkins is doing to the Realms on the Aquisitions Incorporated games. But I don’t recall seeing anything in Dragon Heist about a giant Halaster statue having a fight with the tarrasque that destroyed several city blocks.

In reading the text you quoted, you should have seen the answer to your question. In the first line of that section of text, in fact, where I say “the guy in charge of the team that”. My point wasn’t that he wrote it himself, but that he oversaw and approved the thematic elements of that book. His idea of someone else’s, he is the guy who green lit what came out.

As for the first point, it’s pretty well moot. I’m not a dnd designer.
A good boss doesn’t question and rewrite everything their team produces.
Yeah, he signed off on it and the buck largely stops with him. But that doesn’t mean he’s solely responsible.

But even if it was him, a different story for the 5e Raven Queen for the Realms doesn’t change or affect anything about the Raven Queen in Nentir Vale. Not any more than her killing Nerull in 4e meant that god ceased to exist in Greyhawk.
(But, for what it’s worth, I don’t much like the change either. Not a fan of needless changes of lore.)
 



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