View Profile: Shiroiken - Morrus' Unofficial Tabletop RPG News
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Today, 03:59 AM
    Not big on homebrewing classes & sub-classes. I wish the Warlock was Int instead of Cha, because it would have put another spellcaster using Int and balanced it out a bit. Oddly, despite my heavy dislike of 4E, I really liked the concept of the gish class (Swordblade?), and would love to have seen that as a 1/2 caster class like the paladin and ranger for the wizard. Your experiences have...
    35 replies | 750 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Yesterday, 11:16 PM
    I assume you refer to the "knowledge skills" Arcana, History Nature, and Religion; if not, please clarify. IME, the knowledge skills are very DM dependent, especially since there is no specifically listed use for any of these rolls in the PHB or DMG. Some DMs use them quite a bit, making them very important, but seldom vital to the success of an adventure, even if they do make it easier. Other...
    35 replies | 750 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Yesterday, 07:40 PM
    Smugglers: party left without discovering them, so should remain business as usual. If the Magic Mouth goes off again, they'll be on alert again. Ned: if Ned was with the party when the Mold killed half the party, have him spread tales in town about how haunted the house is, with a yellow ghost stealing the soul of two people. Have him exaggerate the danger as much as possible to keep anyone...
    4 replies | 164 view(s)
    2 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Yesterday, 07:09 PM
    If you are talking about starting up a new campaign world, it can take either a LOT of time, or very little. As a busy DM, you might honestly be best picking up a 5E AP adventure and just running that. If you don't want to do so, you might want to just buy an old copy of one of the existing settings for D&D, but they will require a little updating. Some DMs (especially old school DMs) tend to...
    38 replies | 855 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Yesterday, 05:07 PM
    The only change I've needed was to give Int a modifier on the number of languages and tools. This keeps it from being a complete toilet ability (negative costs you a language or tool) and justifies giving it a small bonus for non-wizards. Wisdom and Charisma don't really need anything, because they have some of the most vital non-combat skills in the game (Insight, Perception, Survival,...
    35 replies | 750 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Thursday, 20th June, 2019, 11:46 AM
    The best solution I've seen for a versatile fighting style is one that relies on the character switching between 1H and 2H each round. An example would be: At the start of your turn you may shift your grip on a versatile weapon you're holding. If you are now holding it 1 handed, you deal +1 damage with it until the start of your next turn (or until you change your grip). If you are now holding...
    42 replies | 1094 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Wednesday, 19th June, 2019, 11:45 AM
    IME, the human is a common option with point buy, since you can easily design a character to maximize your ability scores. Even if rolls are used, the human becomes a strong choice with 4+ odd ability scores. One useful variant is to use the human languages from SCAG, granting Humans an additional racial language. In most human dominated locations, humans are going to speak that language...
    21 replies | 827 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Wednesday, 19th June, 2019, 11:34 AM
    I've already done an underwater encounter where the party was spellcasting. The biggest issue I imposed was losing rounds of holding your breath by casting spells with verbal components. They were in a long underwater tunnel with a water weird in the middle, and one of the characters almost didn't make it to the end because he cast 2 verbal spells during the fight. Of course, none of my players...
    32 replies | 968 view(s)
    2 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Tuesday, 18th June, 2019, 03:25 AM
    This is a good starting point. A city probably has a foreign quarter that outsiders are primarily confined to, unless they have official business elsewhere. Start the players in the foreign district, and maybe get them an opportunity to get past a gate into a nearby district once or twice (a bribeable guard or buying some forged papers). Once you're ready, you can introduce one or two power...
    37 replies | 834 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Monday, 17th June, 2019, 09:44 PM
    From my understanding, a lot of campaigns die out before they finish the AP. Honestly there are quite a few old BECMI, 1E, and 2E adventures that could easily become a full AP with very little additional work (assuming you don't have to start at level 1). Castle Amber is a great example of this, and the Desert of Desolation trilogy is another. I've found when converting old adventures into...
    17 replies | 799 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Monday, 17th June, 2019, 04:01 AM
    I think it depends on the exact situation, which is going to be really rare anyway. IMO, if the attacker never moves and is using a crossbow, bow or other non-movement related attack (such as a spell), then the attacker wouldn't know when/if an attack is coming. Thrown weapons, moving attackers, and even the rotation of a sling would require the attacker to shift their body in a way that (in...
    19 replies | 640 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Monday, 17th June, 2019, 03:51 AM
    As a side note, most of the Drizzt books were written with the rules (at the time) in mind. This is why combats were quick in the early books, because in AD&D combat didn't take very long (about 2-3 rounds, same as in 5E). From my memories of the Dragonlance Chronicles, this was similarly true. The two books written by Gygax for Greyhawk were close to the rules... with some heavy houserules...
    57 replies | 1658 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Friday, 14th June, 2019, 11:42 AM
    Feats run the gambit from really bad to really good, and Durable is near the bottom while Healer is near the top. The problem was that they didn't have a good bar to measure feats against, and IIRC they weren't part of the public playtest. I've tried rebalancing feats, and have come to the conclusion that the ones near the top are really where feats should be. Sharpshooter is the only one I...
    72 replies | 2692 view(s)
    2 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Wednesday, 12th June, 2019, 10:44 PM
    Greater and Elder Gods are Channeled, but are aware of what their followers are doing with the power. They simply focus more on greater aspects of the multi-verse, rather than the mortal realm. Lesser Gods are Inspired, using their blessed followers to advance their goals in the mortal realm, as they cannot directly interfere except in extreme circumstances. Demigods are Inspired, but while...
    31 replies | 1075 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Tuesday, 11th June, 2019, 09:46 PM
    There are a lot of things (really too many to list), so I'll nail down a few that weren't mentioned. Non-WoW orcs. I like my porcine humanoids to not be green skinned strong humans. Also never understood how a half orc was usually taller than either parent. Non-FR elves. Prior to 5E, elves averaged about 5 feet tall... except in the Realms where they're as tall as humans. Now all elves are...
    77 replies | 2921 view(s)
    5 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Monday, 10th June, 2019, 10:11 PM
    Desert of Desolation - 18 -2= 16 Isle of Dread - 6 Castle Amber - 3+1= 4
    210 replies | 8819 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Monday, 10th June, 2019, 11:50 AM
    2. why do we get stats for the underdark elf (drow) but not the underdark dwarf (duergar) or the underdark gnome (svirfneblin)? Because there are people obsessed with the Drow due to the popularity of Drizzt. Additionally, Drow became more common on the surface in the Forgotten Realms (the focused setting when 5E was released) during the 4E era. 3. why isn't there a skill for...
    11 replies | 570 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Sunday, 9th June, 2019, 06:11 PM
    IMO it's best to have a formal agreement that everyone agrees to before a campaign begins. For example, I my group is very communal, with an even cash split (players can buy art objects before they're sold) and magic items are given out by need/usefulness. I'm not a huge fan of this, because it does create a huge disparity in magic items (one player might have 3-4 magic items, while another has...
    14 replies | 489 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Sunday, 9th June, 2019, 05:47 PM
    Probably people remember how great I3 was, and the overall trilogy was good, and they're voting on that, not the FR remake (which was god awful). Desert of Desolation - 25 Isle of Dread - 12 Castle Amber (Chateau d'Amberville) - 7
    210 replies | 8819 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Saturday, 8th June, 2019, 03:16 PM
    I have to say, I've never heard of Heal Sluts or Trippers. I think the person who wrote this has played a lot of WoW and was given a primer on D&D, but has never actually played.
    6 replies | 315 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Saturday, 8th June, 2019, 03:10 PM
    Desert of Desolation - 27 Isle of Dread - 18-2=16 Chateau d'Amberville - 12+1=13 All 3 of these are good. Wondering when the names got changed though...
    210 replies | 8819 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Saturday, 8th June, 2019, 02:46 PM
    I would go with 5 damage per round, but really anything listed as flammable will just burn away areas, like the web spell does. So if you had a paper wall, 1 point of fire would ignite it, and begin to spread the destruction around it.
    32 replies | 774 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Thursday, 6th June, 2019, 10:23 PM
    This would be an interesting concept for when they want to end the current D&D line (5E). Since D&D has always been meant as a fairly generic rules for differing worlds, using this event would be a good way to consolidate the worlds into a single style. The next edition could then be based on using that style exclusively, based on the outcome of the storyline. Some people would probably really...
    31 replies | 1273 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Thursday, 6th June, 2019, 10:08 PM
    1) If the PCs need to torture enemies to gain information, perhaps you should consider your DMing style to have enemies react more realistically. Surrender, offering information in exchange for life and freedom would be a fairly common tactic for losers, except for the most loyal of soldiers (or cultists). 2)If your players automatically jump to torture as a primary method of gaining...
    68 replies | 2734 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Thursday, 6th June, 2019, 04:10 AM
    Lost City = 14 - only one left I'm not that familiar with Desert of Desolation = 24 - the original trilogy was pretty good, but the FR reprint was bad Isle of Dread = 23 - overall good for a hexcrawl, but felt there wasn't enough real plot Castle Amber = 18 - an enjoyable, yet wacky adventure that has the nasty tendency to ruin characters :devil:
    210 replies | 8819 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Wednesday, 5th June, 2019, 03:05 AM
    I haven't found the skills to be unbalanced, with a few notable exceptions. Medicine is just terrible, since it's primary use can be done untrained with no check by using a Healers Kit. Performance didn't seem to fit, considering how many different tools duplicate the same effect, but XGtE helped solve that issue by encouraging doubling up. Some skills are situational, like Animal Handling,...
    70 replies | 1994 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Wednesday, 5th June, 2019, 02:53 AM
    For my regular group, I've never managed to pull it off. They've watched Monty Python's Holy Grail with me far too many times to actually trust a cute creature. I did manage to get a player to roll around in a pile of goldbugs (creature that mimics a gold coin), but that's it. Best scenario was one I wrote, but didn't run. A friend wanted to test some WWII RPG, but wanted to field test it with...
    18 replies | 743 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Wednesday, 5th June, 2019, 02:46 AM
    Lost City - 23 Desert of Desolation = 25 Isle of Dread - 23 - 2 = 21 Castle Amber - 26
    210 replies | 8819 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Monday, 3rd June, 2019, 11:27 AM
    Depends on what you're looking for. Tome of Beasts is you best choice for monsters (it's pretty amazing). Sword Coast Adventuring Guide adds some player crunch, plus some setting information for the Forgotten Realms. If you're looking for a setting, you've got Ravnica, Eberron on DMsGuild, and I'd recommend Thule and Midguard for 3PP.
    33 replies | 1280 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Monday, 3rd June, 2019, 11:23 AM
    The Lost City - 24 Desert of Desolation - 31 Isle of Dread - 20 Castle Amber - 24 Red Hand of Doom - 15 Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth - 1
    210 replies | 8819 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Sunday, 2nd June, 2019, 06:33 PM
    For fighters, not taking feats into consideration, two weapon fighting is better until level 5 since both fighting styles give a bonus to damage, but you have more flexability against multiple opponents. At level 5 it suffers a drop off of a potential 1d6 per round (2d6+2d6 vs. 1d6+1d6+1d6), so it starts to fall behind. At level 11 it falls another 1d6 behind, and at the highest levels yet...
    217 replies | 7276 view(s)
    2 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Sunday, 2nd June, 2019, 08:49 AM
    Having looked it up, it would have been quite an argument starter during the 4E era, but in reality it's a nitpicking philosophical viewpoint. Short version: "dissociative mechanics are all game mechanics that are cause by player decision, not character decision," such as the Lucky feat in 5E. He then goes to talk about why they're "not roleplaying," since it's only roleplaying when you have the...
    9 replies | 707 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Sunday, 2nd June, 2019, 08:15 AM
    The Lost City - 26 Desert of Desolation - 24 Isle of Dread - 27 Castle Amber - 25 Red Hand of Doom - 17 Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth - 11
    210 replies | 8819 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Friday, 31st May, 2019, 11:35 AM
    The Lost City - 24 Desert of Desolation - 25 Test of the Warlords - 14 Isle of Dread - 23 Castle Amber - 26 Red Hand of Doom - 21 Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth - 17
    210 replies | 8819 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Thursday, 30th May, 2019, 08:57 PM
    The best solution is to not play with people whose preferred style of play is murderhobo. The next best solution is to realize that all actions have consequences. How you choose to respond (and there have been many great options already given) should simply fit the setting of your game. I like the idea of allowing the players to run roughshod for a bit, then sending a balanced (but hard)...
    24 replies | 975 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Thursday, 30th May, 2019, 08:48 PM
    I'd like to see something like this, but more like the 2E Faiths and Avatars book from Realms. Rather than using real world pantheons, they could use the existing pantheons from their various settings, and provide details on how to use each priesthood. It could provide suggestions for domains for clerics, circles for druids, oaths for paladins, and even which might have zealot barbarians or...
    71 replies | 3095 view(s)
    2 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Thursday, 30th May, 2019, 11:41 AM
    Keep on the Borderlands 16 Dragons of Despair 6 The Lost City - 22 Desert of Desolation - 20 Test of the Warlords - 20 Isle of Dread - 21 Castle Amber - 24 Red Hand of Doom - 21 Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth - 17
    210 replies | 8819 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Thursday, 30th May, 2019, 02:47 AM
    If you want the same lethality of 2E, all attacks deal double damage. Attacks that hit by 5 more than AC deal 3x damage. Attacks that hit by 10 more deal 4x damage. You won't be using feats, so you don't have to deal with the -5/+10 balance. Hits are brutal, especially if you have low AC.
    173 replies | 8069 view(s)
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  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Wednesday, 29th May, 2019, 09:55 PM
    During the playtest, my DM was still running 4E (he didn't want to use the playtest rules). After that campaign, he decided to run a 2E game. It had some nostalgia, but once you get used to some of the better mechanics from 3E and 4E, it's kinda hard to deal with some of the mechanical weirdness of AD&D. That's why I enjoy 5E so much... it (mostly) takes the best mechanics from 3E and 4E, but...
    173 replies | 8069 view(s)
    9 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Monday, 27th May, 2019, 04:49 AM
    In my Greyhawk campaigns, about 1% of the population attempts the life of an adventurer. Of those, less than 50% survive their first adventure, so there's a high turnover rate. Most who adventure tend to stop after a few levels, as the wealth they've gained is sufficient to live out a comfortable life. Only a scant handful have the drive or necessity to continue on to higher levels, usually not...
    94 replies | 4683 view(s)
    0 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Sunday, 26th May, 2019, 04:57 PM
    Probably because they are so rare that they didn't want to bother with an additional section, like they did with reactions. It would make sense for them to be listed separately IMO, however.
    6 replies | 518 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Shiroiken's Avatar
    Sunday, 26th May, 2019, 05:25 AM
    I would suggest the following: As an action, you may flip this coin, allowing it to land on the ground. If somehow the coin would not land on either face due to an obstruction, there is no effect. If it lands Tymora, it will disappear in a flash of white light, and once before you finish a long rest you may gain advantage on a roll. If it lands Beshaba, it will disappear in a flash of black...
    10 replies | 495 view(s)
    2 XP
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About Shiroiken

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About Shiroiken
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Greyhawk Grognard
About Me:
I started playing when I was 14 or so, with AD&D 1E. I've played and DMed every edition of D&D except OD&D, and have played several RPGs over the years. My favorites are: (A)D&D, L5R, and Deadlands (original RPG). I am currently only playing and running D&D 5E.
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Cincinnati
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Over 40
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I am running a Gyagxian Greyhawk campaign, tying several of Gygax's best adventures together into an semi-AP. The group stated with the Temple of Elemental Evil, then moved on to the Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth (with a stopover at the Forgotten Temple of Tharizdun), before beginning Against the Giants.

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Ohio
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I am running a Gyagxian Greyhawk campaign, tying several of Gygax's best adventures together into an semi-AP. The group stated with the Temple of Elemental Evil, then moved on to the Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth (with a stopover at the Forgotten Temple of Tharizdun), before beginning Against the Giants.
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Friday, 31st May, 2019


Friday, 24th May, 2019

  • 06:35 PM - Celebrim mentioned Shiroiken in post Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh, off to a good start
    It matters because the interesting consequences could be very different. Both interesting, but different. It doesn't work that way in practice. Different implies the possibility of uninteresting. You cannot guarantee that if different outcomes are possible, that they are all equally interesting. And if you can't guarantee that they are all equally interesting, you can't guarantee that they are interesting at all. But more to the point, if the different choices are all interesting, then the choice is not as meaningful in the sense that either the player cannot own the choice, or the choice was always going to lead somewhere anyway so it didn't really matter. Also, it's not impossible. In Apocalypse World, for example, boring outcomes are explicitly against the rules; Well, that settles it then. All I have to do is forbid something by rule and it can never happen. it's actually easier to obtain interesting outcomes for any group that has more creativity than a lump of lead. ...
  • 03:55 PM - 77IM mentioned Shiroiken in post Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh, off to a good start
    That's impossible. In fact, it's self-contradictory. By definition, if the player decision - whether smart or stupid - always leads to ever more interesting decisions, then those decisions are not interesting. If regardless of what I choose, I'm going to get an interesting result, then the decision itself is not meaningful. I could roll the dice or flip a coin for every choice. What does it matter? It matters because the interesting consequences could be very different. Both interesting, but different. Also, it's not impossible. In Apocalypse World, for example, boring outcomes are explicitly against the rules; it's actually easier to obtain interesting outcomes for any group that has more creativity than a lump of lead. The difficulty for me is that D&D is much more preparation-based, which makes this a bit harder to pull off. (I am starting to think that Shiroiken's advice of "take a 15 minute break" is probably the best thing on this thread.) Fundamentally, an RPG is a cooperative endeavor that requires a certain sort of active participation by all parties. If the players make interesting choices, you can always have interesting consequences. But there are some sorts of choices you can't give interesting consequences and still have choice be meaningful. ... There is only so much the GM can do to put in what the players are leaving out. This part, I definitely agree with. The players bear equal responsibility for making the game FUN. "Let's just burn down the adventure" is probably the most recognizable example of a decision that, in a D&D adventure, puts a lot of burden on the DM to very suddenly come up with a bunch of interesting stuff to replace all the stuff that just got burned down...

Tuesday, 22nd January, 2019

  • 12:03 AM - TaranTheWanderer mentioned Shiroiken in post Detect Thoughts spell doubt: can I concentrate on the target without going deeper into its mind?
    That's the only way the caster can remain "on" one person round after round. You can't stay on a person's surface thoughts continuously... after the first round of surface thoughts, the next round you have to probe deeper. Or if you don't want to probe deeper, you either move to another person or you end the spell. I don't really agree with this interpretation. My interpretation is closer Shiroiken s' interpretation. The exact quote is, "As an action, you CAN either shift your attention to another creature's thoughts or attempt to probe further." Nothing in the text says you "MUST USE YOUR ACTION" to shift your attention... So, I interpret it this way: You can read surface thoughts...and choose not to use any action at all and just stay on one person... If you so choose, you may use an action to do something different. The spell stipulates what That action can do: change target or probe deeper. I'm not saying DEFCON is wrong. I just read it differently. Your table has to decide how to play it. Edit: And wording aside, my reasoning for not forcing someone to have to move it is this: If you are forced to move it, a player is just going to keep moving it to and fro between the target subject and another random person, perhaps even an ally. So, for an interrogation which is measured in minutes (or hours)and not 'rounds', it's kind of a moot point whether you...

Thursday, 20th December, 2018

  • 01:15 PM - TaranTheWanderer mentioned Shiroiken in post Character Death Variant
    That kind of situation....I have a Base HP of 16 and I'm at 20 HP therefore I'm in big trouble.....is kind of what we're going for, but it's also an area of concern. The idea is to do away with the "I'm fine till at 0 HP" thinking, but we didn't want to incorporate "death spiral" type mechanics, where their ability or potency weakens with damage. But adding the option to drop unconscious after any hit helps mitigate a bit of the swingy risk at play, but still gives the players some level of control. It's a good idea. So, what both you and Shiroiken are talking about is the Concession rule in FATE. It works well, and this is how it works: You can concede at any time, even after the DM says you are going to be attacked but BEFORE the dice gets rolled. The player who concedes gets to narrate their concession. Examples: -You get hit by an Ogre and have 20 hit points left. On your turn you attack the ogre and say, "I'm only barely able to stand, in a final ditch effort, I attack the ogre but the exertion causes me to fall unconscious." - You get hit by an Ogre, the fight continues and, on the Ogres next turn, the DM says, "The Ogre attacks you!" "Don't bother rolling! I concede the fight. 'The ogres club comes down and I barely have time to shield myself as the club grazes my head, knocking me unconscious as I go sprawling under a bush.'." Obviously, you can concede before the fight starts...that just called surrendering. Or surrender any time...there's probably no need to formalize the rules around surrendering...

Friday, 30th November, 2018

  • 10:12 AM - MNblockhead mentioned Shiroiken in post How do you do secret doors?
    I roll a d20 against the party's passive perception, using a modifier equal to the DC of the door -9. If it beats everyone's Passive Perception, then it's not seen. If someone is actively searching, I allow either a Perception or Investigation (player's choice) instead. Once found, an Investigation check is required to figure out how to open it. Shiroiken, curious why you use "-9" ? -10 seems more in keeping with 5e (unless I'm missing something). How do you handle advantage on Perception? RAW is to apply +5 to passive score but I could also see handling it as 2 rolls and taking the lower (since trying to roll under instead of over).

Monday, 26th November, 2018

  • 12:50 AM - Laurefindel mentioned Shiroiken in post How do you do secret doors?
    I get the concern about passive perception...it’s one of the things where you are damned either way. If you go with passive...a party either auto succeeds or auto fails. With rolling, due to the math of multiple characters rolling, the chance to spot goes way up...so you often have to raise the DC to compensate. And it takes more time. A poster above proposed a third possibility, and the more I think about it, the better I like the idea: the door rolls its own ability check! [edit] that was @Shiroiken in this post So instead of having a set DC, the door has some sort of "hiding bonus" (presumably set by the makers of the secret door) and when the PC walk in front of it, the DM makes a check for the door (DC = passive perception). If the check is successful, the door remains hidden. Otherwise, it is discovered. The DM even has the possibility of giving the door "advantage" if he/she wants to (covered in snow/dust, overgrown with vines and moss, etc). This way, players don’t get a hint for rolling perception out of the blue (and get four attempts for a 4-player party), and passive perception is not always a auto-win/auto-lose.

Thursday, 18th October, 2018

  • 02:09 PM - jasper mentioned Shiroiken in post My (Personal) Early Evaluation of the D&D 5thEd System – Wall of Text
    AlterEgo....Not just one store. I've been to AL in 4 different stores in 3 different states. All charged $5 and said they were 'supposed' to because of AL rules. None of them charge for a PFS or SW game at the same store. The only place that didn't charge was AL at a bar. But even they said they were told they were supposed to charge but didn't because we all came in and bought plenty of drinks and food. ....... Ok I have review all the AL docs I have on hand and I don't find this rule. Are they "WPN" ( I think those are the initials ) stores? If you have facebook join the Adventure League Facebook book page, and ask if this an official. Never mind. I just ask there if a $5 cover was required. Will update if the post gets approved and answered. *** Shiroiken 13. I can't comment on AL, because I don't participate in any organized play anymore. When they started charging the DM to run events, I quit and never looked back. When did this happen? I started AL back in July 2016 and never been charged. Ok I do generally buy my own modules. *** elterEgo I own Seasons 1-8 AL adventures. Some con create and Adept modules. How about you list the adventures you have game with and some the problems in the modules. That way we can see if was bad editing on the module or bad dming.

Tuesday, 18th September, 2018

  • 07:11 PM - Sadras mentioned Shiroiken in post Mitigating players spamming Help, Guidance, Bardic Inspiration, and oh I’ll roll too?
    Interesting. In every 5e table I’ve sat at where Bardic Inspiration or Guidance was used, I saw it used at the time of the check. But you’re saying the correct way is to use them before any check is called for? So the players approach the Duke’s estate, descend to the entrance to the Tomb, or are about to study a book of arcane lore...and Bardic Inspiration or Guidance would be used in advance? I'm not @Shiroiken, but that is exactly what I meant by Immediate vs Prepared. The correct way is to cast the Guidance or provide Bardic Inspiration before the check is required - it rightly should to happen before the active skill use. With group lore checks, do you have the whole party (or whomever is involved/interested) roll, irrespective of proficiency in the pertinent skill? If there is more than one person proficient in the lore, just provide Advantage. If only one person is proficient only they should be allowed to roll - others would not be able to assist. Do you mean you individually don’t allow re-checks, so the Rogue couldn’t attempt to pick the lock but the Warlock with thieves tools proficiency could try? Or do you mean you don’t allow re-checks systemically, so once the Rogue fails to pick a lock that lock is unpickable to the entire party until something major changes? In that instance, if the rogue or the warlock attempted, I would add a complication whether it was a success or...

Sunday, 26th August, 2018

  • 07:39 PM - Oofta mentioned Shiroiken in post How come BBEG coming out never have magic weapons or items?
    I give the bad guys magical weapons depending on the campaign and whether I think I need to up the threat level a little bit. Like Shiroiken mentioned, traditionally most people don't because the PCs will consider it as loot. In addition, the default assumption is that magic items are fairly rare. I have a fairly high magic world so I give the bad guys weapons as appropriate. However, they are frequently cursed and only usable by evil creatures (for various reasons depending on campaign). Since I don't allow evil characters and a blade that needs to be fueled by the blood of an innocent isn't going to be have any value on the open market, I don't have the loot problem. Unless, of course I want to.

Wednesday, 27th June, 2018


Friday, 27th April, 2018

  • 02:28 PM - Oofta mentioned Shiroiken in post Find Steed's Hit Points
    As Shiroiken said, the text is just a holdover from previous editions where the steed was an enhanced version. In my home campaign I give them a little extra oomph, but that's a house rule.

Monday, 12th February, 2018

  • 05:07 AM - Nevvur mentioned Shiroiken in post How long til you modified 5e?
    Thanks to everyone who has responded and/or voted so far. Some remarks: I didn't think "immediately" would be such a common response. I would've included it as an option on the poll if I suspected it would be. @Shiroiken : You wrote that 5e is great for customization. Out of curiosity, how would you compare the customizability of 5e to earlier editions, assuming you have experience with any of them? (open question if anyone else wants to respond) @Satyrn: You mentioned inventing new monsters doesn't count as modifying. I respectfully disagree, but it wouldn't surprise me to learn I'm in the minority in defining homebrew content as such. The distinction for me is whether the thing implies consideration of mechanical impact on game play. Something to do with the mystical developer's "stamp of approval" some GMs prefer or require before giving a thing serious consideration for inclusion in their own games. Not that anyone needs WotC's approval to modify the game and have fun doing it, and anyway, custom monsters are some of the lowest-impact form of house rules (again, as I define it). Even so, I'd like to avoid derailing the thread with a debate about semantics. However you and others approach the ques...

Wednesday, 27th December, 2017

  • 05:15 AM - Hawk Diesel mentioned Shiroiken in post Advice wanted on Player Vs Player Situation
    ...willing to accept help from the necromancer and has been assisted by the necromancer's minions and powers. So even if the rogue believes this power is potentially bad or corrupting, what responsibility does he take for complacency? Also, if they have been traveling together and battling on the same side, there is an assumption that they have saved each other's lives from time to time. Outside of complete sociopaths, it should not be a decision made lightly or easily to kill a brother-in-arms. Also, how does Harry believe the others are going to respond? These are people that have a bond forged in the fires of battle. Even if Derek has the potential to fall as the first necromancer character did, how is the party going to look at Harry? Are they going to see someone that stopped a future Hitler before he had a chance to do real damage? Or as someone that just killed a friend in his sleep, and may decide to do the same to the others when Harry feels justified? While I agree with Shiroiken that a DM should remain neutral and move the story along for everyone's enjoyment, it is also the DM's job to help flesh out the player characters. I would be having this conversation with the player and asking these questions, and pointing out the inconsistencies such as how he justified traveling and fighting with the necromancer for so long and now all of a sudden feels this person should die. I would ask the player to develop a sense of how these feelings and decisions came to be, while pointing out the potential consequences of his actions. Because not only might the group turn on Harry for killing Derek, but if Derek's character has done nothing to break the law then Harry is going to be a murderer, plain and simple. No matter how badly he may have been trying to reform in the past, he has just elevated and escalated his threat level to society and become a vigilante to be hunted by the law. And while I am not familiar with the module, but if the group has any fame or notoriety f...

Monday, 4th December, 2017

  • 04:14 PM - jasper mentioned Shiroiken in post Players Self-Assigning Rolls
    I have agree with Shiroiken “The primary reason is to prevent the "dice determine everything" mentality that some players adopt” over @5eku “how does "the player rolled ahead" have any effect on the GM”. Rolling ahead interrupts the dm while he is giving out information. The player nor the pc knows if a roll is needed. I even a player roll a knowledge check to determine the correct hallway to take. This is after I told the group to listen, take notes, and repeated the data dump three times. So he wanted a die roll to supersede what was a player choice. Or being Snaky… 5ekyu “ The tall dark handsome strange tells of the tell tale heart in which …. Jasper rolls, die hits the table. “That is 12 so 16 on insight so I know he is lying, 14 I going to use deception to shake him down for more money, 15 on sleight of hand to pick his pocket for the needed map, 12 on initiative and I ready my ray of frost if he has a higher initiative!”. Or Jasper, “ the party enters the room, is 40 by 40 has statue of a drago...

Monday, 16th October, 2017

  • 12:28 AM - Nevvur mentioned Shiroiken in post Forced Movement in 5e ?
    ...ong before (relatively speaking) you reached the maximum distance, providing an opportunity to catch the ledge. A Dexterity saving throw is appropriate in virtually every case, and as others have suggested, the DC can be modified by factors like creature size (and appendages), terrain, and distance beyond the ledge. You wrote you're looking for consistency, so maybe something like this: Dexterity saving throw DC 10 Creature size: S = +5, M = 0, L = -5, H = -10. Assumes the creature has limbs that can grab the ledge. A gorgon could reasonably be expected to simply plummet. Terrain: Rough/obstacles = -5, Flat = 0, Smooth = +5, Slippery = +10 Push distance beyond ledge: 5 feet = 0, 10 = feet = +5, 15 feet = +10 Again, just to be clear, I don't actually use a formal system to handle forced movement over ledges, mostly because it doesn't come up enough in my games. However, I would probably arrive at a DC similar to what the above prescribes when making a spot call for the DC. Shiroiken hints at the subject, but one thing I haven't seen mentioned yet is to base the ruling on the style of game. In a game of gritty realism, I'm going to take the immediacy of gravity into greater consideration. In a wuxia game, gravity might not come into play until the end of the forced movement, effectively preventing a catch check if the distance beyond the ledge is greater than the reach of the creature. Regardless of the game style, I'm permissive about letting mooks fly off the edge without a save. I've also designed combats that would be deadly+ if the PCs didn't try to push enemies off ledges.

Saturday, 14th October, 2017

  • 11:39 PM - Ristamar mentioned Shiroiken in post I don't use Passive Perception
    Shouldn't it be +4, though? EDIT: Wow, rough evening, my math/logic was a total failure on the first pass. Using the example Shiroiken provided, a human with an 11 PP (inferring no proficiency, +1 Wis modifier) has a 40% chance to detect a DC 15 trap when converted to a d20 + 3 DC. The trap is found on a natural die roll of 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, or 8. If the same human was actively making a check against a static DC 15 trap, he'd also have a 35% chance with d20 + modifier. The trap is found on a natural die roll of 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, or 20. So, yes, +4 is correct for a randomly generated DC since ties still indicate successful detection assuming the standard ability check versus target DC mechanic. However, if you are treating the trap as an opposed roll where a tie does not indicate success (the situation remains unchanged, thus the trap is not detected), you would use +3 instead.

Thursday, 21st September, 2017


Sunday, 4th June, 2017

  • 01:26 PM - clearstream mentioned Shiroiken in post Making Combat More Mobile
    Trust me on this : you don't want fights to become more mobile. In the group I DM for, there's a Barbarian/Rogue with the Mobile feat and it's utterly ridiculous. He strikes, then retreats 50 feet (or 100 feet if he needs to). Try to picture that seriously, it makes no sense at all. Good advice. I feel like it can make sense, but as your example goes on to show, it can be very annoying. the other players were bored to death because both the Deva and the player were moving too fast for them to catch up with, and the Barbarian was bent on retreating AWAY from the group because he didn't want to give the angel a chance to hit him. Ugh. Possibly fun for the Barbarian, but dull for the other players. What I think I want to see is more shifting and changing of targets while retaining coherence. Perhaps then the advice from Shiroiken above makes most sense: make more use of moving around enemies without leaving their reach.

Friday, 26th May, 2017

  • 04:31 PM - clearstream mentioned Shiroiken in post Moving while blind
    ... For me, suspension of disbelief is harmed by doing nothing. For example, some of my players have asked with a tone of incredulity if they can move unhindered when blind? Isn't treating clear terrain as difficult a simple rule? I kind of share your concern about adding complexity so I might leave it at only that. This is not RAW, but when a character is in darkness or blinded, I require a Perception roll to see if they head in the correct direction. (It's incredibly easy to get turned around in complete darkness.) I give advantage if they have a wall or some such near at hand. Whether they succeed on the Per roll or not, treat the terrain as difficult and no dashing. If they fail the Per roll, they tell me how far they are moving and I randomly roll their direction. Seems to work fine, as I impose the same problems on enemies. That perception check could be worth a try. The question is whether it adds enough value to be worth remembering to call for the check? What did you think of @Shiroiken 's suggestion of a Dex check to avoid falling?


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Monday, 24th June, 2019

  • 12:08 AM - FrogReaver quoted Shiroiken in post Ability Score Rebalancing
    I assume you refer to the "knowledge skills" Arcana, History Nature, and Religion; if not, please clarify. IME, the knowledge skills are very DM dependent, especially since there is no specifically listed use for any of these rolls in the PHB or DMG. Some DMs use them quite a bit, making them very important, but seldom vital to the success of an adventure, even if they do make it easier. Other DMs barely think about them, and either give out the information without a check, make the check too high to be worthwhile, or (worst of all) having the roll give out completely worthless, or even distracting information. Obviously most DMs fit somewhere between these extremes, but it does reduce the overall value of these skills for most games. Giving Intelligence a slight bonus (languages and tools) helps make it less of a "dump stat." To be fair, I know some DMs also nerf other skills, but at least there is a section in the PHB or DMG that says how they're to be used. I also knew a DM that hated rogues...

Sunday, 23rd June, 2019

  • 11:31 PM - Draegn quoted Shiroiken in post How long does it take to generally take to set a campaign up
    If you are talking about starting up a new campaign world, it can take either a LOT of time, or very little. As a busy DM, you might honestly be best picking up a 5E AP adventure and just running that. If you don't want to do so, you might want to just buy an old copy of one of the existing settings for D&D, but they will require a little updating. Some DMs (especially old school DMs) tend to create a "top down" approach, where they design the cosmos, deities, and general world history before detailing out the starting location and 1st adventure. This creates some vibrant, detailed settings that are often used for multiple campaigns. The downside to this is that it usually takes months to prepare, depending on how detailed you want to get it. This is probably not a good choice for a family DM, unless you are a player currently and plan to DM the next campaign. Ed Greenwood suggests using the "bottom up" approach. You detail out the starting location (village/town/city) and 1st adventure firs...
  • 08:00 PM - Beleriphon quoted Shiroiken in post How long does it take to generally take to set a campaign up
    Ed Greenwood suggests using the "bottom up" approach. You detail out the starting location (village/town/city) and 1st adventure first. You only design a half-dozen deities that are worshiped in the area, along with a few power groups (nobles, merchants, thieves' guild, etc.). Give a little thought to the surrounding area, such as topography and potential adventures. Run a couple of adventures in the starting location, while dropping hints about the surrounding areas (from rumors and news from travelers). If the players seem interested, set up an adventure in that area, and start detailing it. The is a much faster method, and can be done in only a week or so, but the downside is that your players can ask for information you don't readily have, requiring you to make it up on the fly (or just admit to the players, and tell them later). This is what I did. Built the city I want to start in, brief over view of the surrounding area, and some local threats and what not.
  • 05:30 PM - bedir than quoted Shiroiken in post Ability Score Rebalancing
    The only change I've needed was to give Int a modifier on the number of languages and tools. This keeps it from being a complete toilet ability (negative costs you a language or tool) and justifies giving it a small bonus for non-wizards. Wisdom and Charisma don't really need anything, because they have some of the most vital non-combat skills in the game (Insight, Perception, Survival, Deception, Persuasion). Dex is a bit strong, but I can live with it. After Xanathar's and Saltmarsh the importance of tools is elevated enough in my campaign that the lack of importance of intelligence is the base game essentially disappeared with the change you made. I do have a tool proficiency for siege weapons.
  • 05:27 PM - FrogReaver quoted Shiroiken in post Ability Score Rebalancing
    The only change I've needed was to give Int a modifier on the number of languages and tools. This keeps it from being a complete toilet ability (negative costs you a language or tool) and justifies giving it a small bonus for non-wizards. Wisdom and Charisma don't really need anything, because they have some of the most vital non-combat skills in the game (Insight, Perception, Survival, Deception, Persuasion). Dex is a bit strong, but I can live with it. Why do you find knowing things to be unimportant?

Monday, 17th June, 2019

  • 10:04 PM - lowkey13 quoted Shiroiken in post On the Inscrutability of AD&D and Ye Olde Styles of Play
    From my understanding, a lot of campaigns die out before they finish the AP. Honestly there are quite a few old BECMI, 1E, and 2E adventures that could easily become a full AP with very little additional work (assuming you don't have to start at level 1). Castle Amber is a great example of this, and the Desert of Desolation trilogy is another. I've found when converting old adventures into 5E, it's easier to just take the concept of the adventure, then boil away a lot of the extra stuff. I ran Against the Cult of the Reptile God in 3 sessions of 4 hours each by cutting the temple down to 1 encounter of cultists and the lair itself into 6 increasingly difficult encounters. If I'd tried to run it as it was, my players probably would have tired of the combat before finishing the temple. Well, that's what I was trying to think of- the APs seem much, much, much longer! X2 (Castle Amber) I've run several times in 5e- love it (although the ending is anti-climactic without revisions because of the 5...
  • 04:05 AM - Travis Henry quoted Shiroiken in post Narrative/Novel D&D...ND&D. Imagine if the game played just like the D&D novels?
    As a side note, most of the Drizzt books were written with the rules (at the time) in mind. This is why combats were quick in the early books, because in AD&D combat didn't take very long (about 2-3 rounds, same as in 5E). From my memories of the Dragonlance Chronicles, this was similarly true. The two books written by Gygax for Greyhawk were close to the rules... with some heavy houserules (included in the appendix). Yeah but I still suspect that even the AD&D 1st Edition (or 2nd Edition) DL series of modules took a lot longer to play through, than the time it takes to read the Dragonlance Chronicles novels. The problem is the difference between game time and real time. A 4 hour session can take anywhere from a few minutes of game time (6 second rounds with a crap-load of combat) to weeks, months, or even years of game time, depending on the needs of the story. The closest part of the game that matches game time to real time is social encounters fully roleplayed out, and even those are throw...

Saturday, 15th June, 2019

  • 08:51 AM - coolAlias quoted Shiroiken in post Durable Feat is weak, Healer feat is too strong
    Sharpshooter is the only one I feel needs tuned down, and only a little (double short range and reduce cover by 3 AC). A solution I came up with is to restrict characters with Sharpshooter to only one of the benefits per attack: they can either ignore cover, range, or do tons of damage, but not all at the same time. They can of course freely mix up which option they choose per attack, even within the same turn. I find this still lets them be awesome archers without being freaking laser beams.

Friday, 14th June, 2019

  • 02:24 PM - Garthanos quoted Shiroiken in post Durable Feat is weak, Healer feat is too strong
    This makes increasing some of the weaker feats a bit harder, and honestly it's easier to combine like-minded feats. Stacking Durable and Toughness together puts them right about on par with Healer. Giving more is almost always better than Nerfing ... The flavors of those are obviously the same.

Sunday, 9th June, 2019

  • 10:10 PM - vostygg quoted Shiroiken in post Treasure Division Policy - Feedback Requested
    IMO it's best to have a formal agreement that everyone agrees to before a campaign begins. For example, I my group is very communal, with an even cash split (players can buy art objects before they're sold) and magic items are given out by need/usefulness. I'm not a huge fan of this, because it does create a huge disparity in magic items (one player might have 3-4 magic items, while another has none), but that's their preference and I deal with it when I'm a player. I think your system is pretty fair, but offer a few suggestions: Allow a party pool of funds for communal expenses. This can be used for rations, inn stays, as well as spell components that are useful for the group. Augury is a good example of this, but my group also includes Revivify (your group might have the cost deducted from the player who died, however). Figure out how your group handled missing players. Some groups don't want players to get any loot for sessions a player misses. If so, you have to track that separatel...
  • 05:37 PM - the Jester quoted Shiroiken in post The D&D Multiverse needs a "Crisis on Infinite Oerths"
    This would be an interesting concept for when they want to end the current D&D line (5E). Since D&D has always been meant as a fairly generic rules for differing worlds, using this event would be a good way to consolidate the worlds into a single style. That rather misses the point of having multiple settings in the first place.

Saturday, 8th June, 2019

  • 06:36 PM - Legatus_Legionis quoted Shiroiken in post Last Man Standing: Best D&D Modules
    Desert of Desolation - 27 Isle of Dread - 18-2=16 Chateau d'Amberville - 12+1=13 All 3 of these are good. Wondering when the names got changed though... Wonder no further: Reply #124 Thursday, 6th June, 2019, 12:20 AM Lost City = 12 - sorry Desert of Desolation = 25 Isle of Dread = 21 Chateau d'Amberville = 19 - Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries!

Friday, 7th June, 2019

  • 01:13 AM - flametitan quoted Shiroiken in post The D&D Multiverse needs a "Crisis on Infinite Oerths"
    This would be an interesting concept for when they want to end the current D&D line (5E). If I recall, that was how they ended 2nd Edition AD&D, via Die, Vecna, Die! At a minimum, its plotline combined Ravenloft, Greyhawk, and Planescape. Since D&D has always been meant as a fairly generic rules for differing worlds, using this event would be a good way to consolidate the worlds into a single style. The next edition could then be based on using that style exclusively, based on the outcome of the storyline. Some people would probably really enjoy that. I would guess that the majority would not. I would think it'd be on the unpopular side, as a part of D&D's popularity is its legacy of many different worlds of different styles (even if most people just make their own,) and implicitly taking that option of differing styles away is probably going to upset those who don't want to play whatever style WotC says is now the canonical "D&D Style."

Wednesday, 5th June, 2019

  • 07:29 AM - Paul Farquhar quoted Shiroiken in post Monsters Disguised as Cute Things
    They've watched Monty Python's Holy Grail with me far too many times to actually trust a cute creature. My group is just the same. I've taken to putting in actual cute things, just to frighten them. True story: In last week's game the party came across a black cat lying in front of a cosy fire, the McGuffin around it's neck. What was the first thing the wizard did? "I try speaking to it in Abyssal".
  • 03:59 AM - DEFCON 1 quoted Shiroiken in post skill proficiencies point buy
    I haven't found the skills to be unbalanced, with a few notable exceptions. Medicine is just terrible, since it's primary use can be done untrained with no check by using a Healers Kit. Performance didn't seem to fit, considering how many different tools duplicate the same effect, but XGtE helped solve that issue by encouraging doubling up. Some skills are situational, like Animal Handling, Slight of Hand, and the various Intelligence skills, but they have their usefulness. The only one I find unbalanced is Perception, and the easiest fix to that is to change several uses of it to be intelligence/investigation instead. Social skills are going to be needed by the social characters, but they're balanced among themselves. Stealth is a useful skill, but already balanced by the desire for Perception. Survival is almost necessary while traveling off-road, but you really only need one character with it. Yep, agreed wholeheartedly. That's why in my games I: Removed Animal Handling-- use CHA (Natu...

Sunday, 2nd June, 2019

  • 11:30 PM - Charlaquin quoted Shiroiken in post Improving Two-Weapon Fighting
    The easily solution I've found is to add a weapon trait to several 1d4 damage weapons: "Offhand - you can use this weapon with any other one handed weapon to perform the two weapon fighting bonus action." With 1d8 (main hand) and 1d4 (off hand), the drop off is much less with multiple attacks, and the damage curve flattens out more. It would still be a slight issue at levels 11+, but not enough to worry about IMO (you still have more flexibility). This is the best solution, in my opinion.

Friday, 31st May, 2019

  • 04:18 PM - ART! quoted Shiroiken in post What previous supplements would you like to see brought back for 5e?
    I'd like to see something like this, but more like the 2E Faiths and Avatars book from Realms. Rather than using real world pantheons, they could use the existing pantheons from their various settings, and provide details on how to use each priesthood. It could provide suggestions for domains for clerics, circles for druids, oaths for paladins, and even which might have zealot barbarians or rangers. I would so buy this. I think anything that helps players play their characters and gives DMs stuff to work into their backgrounds and into plots is a good idea. I'd argue for including a section on real-world pantheons, or maybe even a whole separate book? I was just thinking the other day, that a really slick move would be for Wizards to partner with a Chinese design company to create a distinctly Asian-oriented version of D&D. Not just translating the core books; I'm talking all new art and writing, a modified list of classes and spells and monsters and items, and of course, a defaul...
  • 12:43 AM - dave2008 quoted Shiroiken in post What previous supplements would you like to see brought back for 5e?
    I'd like to see something like this, but more like the 2E Faiths and Avatars book from Realms. Rather than using real world pantheons, they could use the existing pantheons from their various settings, and provide details on how to use each priesthood. It could provide suggestions for domains for clerics, circles for druids, oaths for paladins, and even which might have zealot barbarians or rangers. I would like both personally, the setting gods and the ones from the 1e version.

Thursday, 30th May, 2019

  • 01:36 AM - SkidAce quoted Shiroiken in post Returning to 2nd Edition
    During the playtest, my DM was still running 4E (he didn't want to use the playtest rules). After that campaign, he decided to run a 2E game. It had some nostalgia, but once you get used to some of the better mechanics from 3E and 4E, it's kinda hard to deal with some of the mechanical weirdness of AD&D. That's why I enjoy 5E so much... it (mostly) takes the best mechanics from 3E and 4E, but brings back the style of AD&D. I'd much rather house-rule 5E to fit my AD&D preferences than to go back and play AD&D. Quoted for Truth!

Monday, 27th May, 2019

  • 06:49 AM - ModernApathy quoted Shiroiken in post Burning books question
    It also depends on how literate your campaign world is. In medieval Europe (the basis for most campaigns), very few books would even exist, held closely by the rich and powerful. The average person couldn't read, and probably couldn't count much higher than 10 or 20 due to lack of education. In my Greyhawk, most people are illiterate, so burning books would be unnecessary for information control (burning bards would be more effective). If I remember correctly in earlier editions you had to take writing as a skill in order to be able to do so (maybe this was just a house-rule). Where as in 5E it's assumed if you can speak a language you can also read and write it, which I understand from a simplifying the skills point of view, but I've always kinda disliked that. I feel like this should be more tied to backgrounds, but I digress. It's an interesting thread, it's given me some ideas for my own homebrew world in which some terrible events have been brought about by magic in the past and peopl...


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