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  1. Yes, why wouldn't they? Leather, wooden...

    Yes, why wouldn't they? Leather, wooden shields... one unusual magic item was scalemail made of enchanted autumn leaves. But, like Glassteele or something, no.

    Clerics, no, loss of...
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    Well, sure, if he has a squire. If he takes a...

    Well, sure, if he has a squire. If he takes a page(npi) from Robillar, OTOH, and has a wizard Henchman, even one of half his level, it could be well worth it, in some situations.
  3.   Not in the sense that you add the damage bonus to...

    Not in the sense that you add the damage bonus to the extra crit dice (and that goes for any bonus that doesn't say it adds to crit dice, but to damage rolls).
    But, yes, in the sense that all your...
  4. Valid concerns can be expressed without relying...

    Valid concerns can be expressed without relying on double standards. It's not that hard a bar to clear.

    And, answering concerns in detail is not dismissal.
  5. Gotta ask: which Gamma World? Like, what's the...

    Gotta ask: which Gamma World? Like, what's the copyright date?

    IDK about "epic" (that implies all sorts of things to me that are not synonymous with dungeoncrawling), but the long arc implied...
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    Ok, I can kinda see why. BTW, a friend &...

    Ok, I can kinda see why.

    BTW, a friend & fellow GM back in the day used to say "Pop like a toad!" usually in reference to some monster or character being attacked by something quite potent, or...
  7. Sci-fi for two of the 9 Traditions and 2-3 of the...

    Sci-fi for two of the 9 Traditions and 2-3 of the 5 Conventions (depending on how far the Progenitors are taking it in the story, and the Syndicate & NWO don't need to go there, at all) - cyberpunk...
  8. Sure. Focus fire is the obvious example - hp...

    Sure. Focus fire is the obvious example - hp damage imposes no penalties, so, focusing on one enemy at a time is always the best tactic, and accepting hp damage in return for enabling some other...
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    Oh, wow, so exactly like a Companion character,...

    Oh, wow, so exactly like a Companion character, then? That's nice. Odd choice of name, when Companion hasn't been used for anything else, and Henchman is so much more traditional... ::shrug::
    …...
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    Also the ratio between types of rests is a...

    Also the ratio between types of rests is a factor.

    As we all know, D&D has always depended on pacing to impose balance upon class resources and encounter challenge levels. In the olden days it...
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    I'm with you on most of these, but two of them, I...

    I'm with you on most of these, but two of them, I think, the underlying reason is too compelling:
    A hard 1 spell/round limit might be simpler. From the start of your turn, to the start of your...
  12. I'm just recently well enough to return to...

    I'm just recently well enough to return to running my campaign, and the first session back I ran an underlevel complexity 4 SC to handle progress toward finding a certain goal in the Elemental Chaos....
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    IDK. walls are typically made of stone, their not...

    IDK. walls are typically made of stone, their not nearly as dense as some PCs can be...
    ;P
    But, seriously, go right ahead. If a creature can become non-corporeal or something, it could slip right...
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    Yeah, most saves not scaling is an obvious...

    Yeah, most saves not scaling is an obvious problem. Cancelling out the initial +2, though is just shifting the issue to 1st level in a way.

    I wouldn't have raised the save DC, instead, give the...
  15. rec.games.frp.storyteller and...

    rec.games.frp.storyteller and alt.games.white-wolf were very active back in the day, though discussion covered mechanics and PbP as well as more.

    But what sorta made that claim ring a little true,...
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    Sure, the DM is as free, in 5e, to narrate...

    Sure, the DM is as free, in 5e, to narrate success when players declare the characters flee, upon realizing they've taken on something too much for them too soon.

    13A even has a formal mechanic...
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    That is a really good idea, and on more than just...

    That is a really good idea, and on more than just the topic of simplification.

    Doesn't that rapidly overwhelm proficiency scaling/BA? (Or did I miss that being replaced with a similar level...
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    Consuming Action Surge - which a 5e Fighter in a...

    Consuming Action Surge - which a 5e Fighter in a standard/assumed 6-8 encounter/2-3 Short rest day would get to use about as often as a 4e daily* - might make sense, to activate a more powerful...
  19. Count each formation if regulars or undisciplined...

    Count each formation if regulars or undisciplined mob as a swarm. A modest sized battle becomes readily doable with regular rules, and individual high-level creatures can interact with them in a...
  20. Nod. None of those eventualities would be...

    Nod. None of those eventualities would be accomplished by simply giving the guns in question moar damage - That'd simply result in a dead hero, or, if the numbers added up just right, an unconscious...
  21. Its not like 1e casters would lag multiple levels...

    Its not like 1e casters would lag multiple levels behind, the Fighter, their whole careers. All casters didnt even consistently level slower than all non-casters. You just described LFQW. Yeah, a...
  22. Strictly Order Of Hermes, then. Arbitrarily...

    Strictly Order Of Hermes, then. Arbitrarily narrow, but doable - an Horizon Realm or just some little college town the Ascension War doesn't quite reach, with Bygones instead of other supernaturals.
  23. I suppose that's varied a bit from one edition to...

    I suppose that's varied a bit from one edition to the next. Back in the day, there was a rule along the lines of "sleeping or otherwise helpless creatures can be slain at a rate of 1/round." In...
  24. If you're watching that scene in the movie, do...

    If you're watching that scene in the movie, do you really expect the hero to get shot dead in that moment? Seriously?

    That's not to the contrary, at all. That's what pemerton would call...
  25. Prof to AC as long as you move on your turn could...

    Prof to AC as long as you move on your turn could work.
  26. That was the FASE-RIP system RIPped off from the...

    That was the FASE-RIP system RIPped off from the first Marvel Superheroes.
    Thanks for the reminder. I can add those to my list, too. ;(

    I'm a huge GW fan, and the most-D&D-ish editions, the...
  27. I don't think that's quite fair. I mean, yes,...

    I don't think that's quite fair. I mean, yes, casters were generally Tier 1 & 2, and non-casters 4 & 5. But it was hardly new nor unique to 3e, worse than ever, perhaps, but only a /little/ worse...
  28. It peaked at 5 or 6, in the oWoD as I recall. ...

    It peaked at 5 or 6, in the oWoD as I recall.

    And one of them, Mage, you could take careening off into almost any genre. Virtual Adepts & Akashic Brothers vs Iteration X & Syndicate: Cyberpunk. ...
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    It's a truism of internet discussion that if you...

    It's a truism of internet discussion that if you make a general statement about what people have done, someone will pipe up with a testimonial to the exact opposite.

    This time, it's me.

    My...
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    There is a lot of complexity, but it's hard to...

    There is a lot of complexity, but it's hard to jettison without depriving players of options.

    Obviously, first, don't use any optional rules. Feats & MCing are just added complexity.

    Bonus...
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    Yeah, the primal spirits felt a trifle forced or...

    Yeah, the primal spirits felt a trifle forced or out of left field, maybe the decision to include a Shaman class had something to do with it? Druids as a remnant of 'old religion' always appealed to...
  32. Nod. Feel or expectations seems like it's the...

    Nod. Feel or expectations seems like it's the main stumbling block

    Hit points can and do model the same sorts of things when swords, arrows, fireballs, and lightning blots are flying around. But...
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    Ah, so you know my players! ;)

    Ah, so you know my players! ;)
  34. I don't suppose there's a whole lot of functional...

    I don't suppose there's a whole lot of functional difference between HP as 'plot armor' or hp as 'ability to defend yourself.' Either way, if you're being shot at, you're not being hit, or taking...
  35. IIRC, Steve Jackson himself came right out and...

    IIRC, Steve Jackson himself came right out and said it. May well have been in one of the GURPS books. But, remember, we're talking acknowledgement of 'inspiration' - there's no hint of plagiarism...
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    Exactly. The DM /can/ narrate a villain's escape...

    Exactly. The DM /can/ narrate a villain's escape if he and his group are playing for a dramatic story arc, or, he can narrate his capture/death because the players like 'getting it right' and...
  37. I don't suppose there's a whole lot of functional...

    I don't suppose there's a whole lot of functional difference. Either way, if you're being shot at, you're not being hit, or taking less serious hits, whether it's modeling author force (plot armor),...
  38. Nothing most 70+ y/o athyreotic stroke survivors...

    Nothing most 70+ y/o athyreotic stroke survivors aren't taking.
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    I'm not sure any particular range of integers is...

    I'm not sure any particular range of integers is automatically fun.

    The fighter /is/ supposed to be "Best at Fighting" (with weapons) (without magic). Feats and magic items shouldn't be required...
  40. box (n.2) "a blow," c. 1300, of uncertain origin,...

    box (n.2) "a blow," c. 1300, of uncertain origin, older than the verb, possibly related to Middle Dutch boke, Middle High German buc, and Danish bask, all meaning "a blow;" perhaps imitative;
    box...
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    In 5e, that's not even a switch or an override,...

    In 5e, that's not even a switch or an override, it's just making different rulings. The villain tries to escape, the DM narrates successful escape, the players try to stop him, the DM narrates...
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    Wow, when you put it that way, the fighter...

    Wow, when you put it that way, the fighter sounds, not at all great.
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    Rulings aren't 'house rules,' they're a necessary...

    Rulings aren't 'house rules,' they're a necessary DM function, especially in 5e, where essentially every action resolution technically includes a ruling from the DM.
    The thing about a starting...
  44. That'd work for a lot of 'em. There's 5 other...

    That'd work for a lot of 'em. There's 5 other saves but rarely for 1/2....
    ...does 5e also have Mettle, I wonder?
  45. 3e had swarms (and hordes? for size M...

    3e had swarms (and hordes? for size M participants, I think it was), and so does 5e, so I see no objection to the observation.
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    That's a good point. If the strategy encourages...

    That's a good point. If the strategy encourages holding on to high level slots longer, it may cause the caster to pass on good opportunities to use the slot very effectively early in the day, or...
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    IDK, maybe: Versatile Fighting Style You gain...

    IDK, maybe:

    Versatile Fighting Style
    You gain the benefit of Greatweapon Fighting Style when wielding a versatile weapon two-handed. Choose a second fighting style useable with a one-handed...
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    A Tiefling, a Cambion, and an Alu-Demon walk into...

    A Tiefling, a Cambion, and an Alu-Demon walk into a bar...
  49. The 2e CPH went into that idea in considerable...

    The 2e CPH went into that idea in considerable detail. Forces & Philosophies, I found it very interesting and developed a number of them back in the day.
  50. Close competitors, I guess, rivalry can be...

    Close competitors, I guess, rivalry can be bitter. Like the more contentious D&D and Pathfinder fans - though there's a lot more mutual appreciation, in those broader d20 communities, I think.
    ...
  51. I've played both (but never GM'd GURPS). They...

    I've played both (but never GM'd GURPS).
    They use a similar resolution system, not so dissimilar to d20, really, but 3d6 roll-under with all sorts of modifiers. They're both build systems, and...
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    Since all 5e classes use magic, it's about the...

    Since all 5e classes use magic, it's about the same thing, really. (Though, yeah, that makes the Fighter & Thief "arcane.") ;P
  53. That's the thing, whatever plot armor mechanism...

    That's the thing, whatever plot armor mechanism you settle on, it'll either make only that last bullet a 'real threat' - or it'll fail as plot armor (at least some of the time, a "protagonist who...
  54. Always great to see that happen! :)

    Always great to see that happen! :)
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    the DM must make a ruling. Seriously, the...

    the DM must make a ruling.

    Seriously, the observation that "no rule says you can't" doesn't mean "the rules say you can."
    Nor vice-versa.

    It's 5e, Rulings not Rules. Even when the rules...
  56. Whoops! Should have gone Barbarian. ;) ...

    Whoops! Should have gone Barbarian. ;)

    3.x/PF Fighter: elegant, but not simplistic. It's great for system masters, because you /can/ wring an adequate performance out of it through the...
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    Yeah, they have diabolic ancestry, not Demonic. ...

    Yeah, they have diabolic ancestry, not Demonic. Totally different.




    Typical play wasn't.

    All we can go on, for sure, is the written rules at the time (& commentary, there was a lot of...
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    From the discussion of Metics thread: Sure...

    From the discussion of Metics thread:

    Sure sounds better than that game you guys are discussing, here.
  59. Agreed. 5e definitely found the right compromise...

    Agreed.
    5e definitely found the right compromise between advanced and acceptable.


    TotM may be a relatively new label, but the necessity of playing without a play surface has been around as...
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    Spam spam spam spam. Lovely spam! Wonderfulspam!...

    Spam spam spam spam. Lovely spam! Wonderfulspam! Spam spa-a-a-a-a-am spam spa-a-a-a-a-am spam. Lovely spam!Lovely spam! Lovely spam! Lovely spam! Lovely spam! Spam spamspam spam!
  61. Yep. Mike stated his intent, in the playtest,...

    Yep. Mike stated his intent, in the playtest, that Fighters & Wizards would do it differently, but they'd be able to take on armies at the highest levels.
  62. And you play D&D. My condolences. That'd...

    And you play D&D.
    My condolences.

    That'd be a /fair/ game. Those options may still be imbalanced, players of any skill which just ignore the inferior ones.
    If it is, it'll be pointed out...
  63. Yeah, CON is a bit of an uberstat in 4e, because...

    Yeah, CON is a bit of an uberstat in 4e, because it adds to 1st level hps, and surges, which scale, so it getting the fuzzy end on skills is one thing. STR getting the same treatment was an issue,...
  64. There were 17 skills, INT applied to 3 of them:...

    There were 17 skills, INT applied to 3 of them: prettymuch exactly a fair share.
    INT was very worthwhile for a warlord because it powered some commanding presence choices and power riders, the sane...
  65. Niether a 3e nor a 5e thread, but no bringing...

    Niether a 3e nor a 5e thread, but no bringing back a problematic mechanic so INT can add to it, not ideal.

    Also not as pressing an issue in 4e, where INT isn't disfavored the way it is in 5e.
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    ...and, when you take Heal, everything else goes...

    ...and, when you take Heal, everything else goes from a risk of not being used that day, to a certainty of not being used.

    Which is how the Cleric got it's Band-aid stereotype back in the day. ...
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    You no longer have that high-level slot to...

    You no longer have that high-level slot to spontaneously cast a high-level spell that could win that encounter - or the next one, or obviate some other challenge.

    Its a very real downside to the...
  68. Its precisely because I'm all too familiar with a...

    Its precisely because I'm all too familiar with a variety of ways of modeling - and failing to model - plot armor, that I find the idea tweaking firearms to high-damage in D&D is a poor solution.

    ...
  69. To start with, try the visiting alumni vs the...

    To start with, try the visiting alumni vs the graduating class, but, for the sake of simplicity - almost as simple as the mob of fighters vs the champion - limit everyone to just casting Magic...
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    Yep. RQ 3rd added sorcery. The RQII I played...

    Yep. RQ 3rd added sorcery.
    The RQII I played had Battlemagic, which you just learned and spent POW to use. Battlemagic used a focus, like a lesser rune, that you needed to cast it, and your own...
  71. Or something like the old samurai 'psychic duel?'...

    Or something like the old samurai 'psychic duel?' (Which I don't remember well enough - it might've just been a contested check.)


    5e's so all-in with sub-classes, I'd want to go that route as...
  72. The difference between a 4e minion and just a...

    The difference between a 4e minion and just a very under-level 5e monster is mainly that the minion has a chance of surviving AEs ('missed' attack never damages a minion - in 5e, it'd be "minions are...
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    As in other whack-a-mole threads, one common...

    As in other whack-a-mole threads, one common theme I see is that the solutions generally seem to work by hosing the healer's allies.

    To approach it from the other side, you could:
    1) Make...
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    Same benefit as re-rolling initiative, with less...

    Same benefit as re-rolling initiative, with less complication.
  75. I mean, if you want that, fine, but I don't think...

    I mean, if you want that, fine, but I don't think that model the genre that well - that is, you might manage to create high-damage guns, low-hp characters, combat rules to incentivize them dodging...
  76. But I don't think high-damage guns and reduced hp...

    But I don't think high-damage guns and reduced hp PCs is part of the solution, either. HP are a central mechanic in D&D, they're essentially plot armor, and old-west heroes are as plot-armored as...
  77. Grabbing just keeps you from running away in 5e,...

    Grabbing just keeps you from running away in 5e, they'd have to immobilize both his hands if the spell had S components, or gag him to stop V components, but those aren't things the Grappled...
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    Ironic. One 3.0 build I never got to use was a...

    Ironic. One 3.0 build I never got to use was a "backseat adventurer" - a sage, he just kibitzed from the back ranks, but it gave you bonuses. In 4e he'd've been a Tactical Warlord, in 5e I guess...
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    Yes, you may goad monsters into Overkill and...

    Yes, you may goad monsters into Overkill and 'waste' their damage or 'gain' let's-pretend-healing damage due to heal-from-0.

    Sure, bloodied, even without disadvantage, did that for most...
  80. ...before you do something cool or heroic, at any...

    ...before you do something cool or heroic, at any rate.

    There's really no good* reason hp couldn't work well in another genre.

    Yeah, 5e did cut some corners as far as off-turn actions &...
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    The whole Animal Companion thing was just a take...

    The whole Animal Companion thing was just a take on the old Animal Friendship spell: it exists in 5e. You could use it to befriend (charm) and train (advantage on 'social interaction' should count)...
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    I'm not sure I agree that's what's going on: It...

    I'm not sure I agree that's what's going on: It may be more a matter of casters having better things to do with their high level spells than heal up a damage sponge significantly, rather than just...
  83. I think they'd both just be /confused/...

    I think they'd both just be /confused/...
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    I can't agree. Both the 'role' and the 'playing'...

    I can't agree. Both the 'role' and the 'playing' refer to quite different things depending on whether you're roleplaying with a therapist, a friend-with-benefits, or a GM...
    ...or a director.

    ...
  85. Hero System (Champions! c1981 through HSR/BBB...

    Hero System (Champions! c1981 through HSR/BBB c1989-99 & FRED was OK, too)

    1) Effects-based universal point-buy system. You can build any character, monster, gizmo, power, cool move, hazard, or,...
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    Well, starting with 3e there were explicit...

    Well, starting with 3e there were explicit encounter guidelines. They may not have always delivered a consistent level of difficulty, but they could be said to tend one way or the other?
    ...
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    Its a daily struggle... In a way, yeah, I suppose...

    Its a daily struggle... In a way, yeah, I suppose so.
    In seeking balance, 4e had to push the envelope of D&D sensibilities on the martial side, but still barely covered what they might do in an...
  88. That was mainly 3e, I think. I mean, 3e/d20 was...

    That was mainly 3e, I think. I mean, 3e/d20 was hugely influential, so that's not dismissing the point, but classic D&D was prettymuch choose race, choose class, hold on for dear life. 4e, you could...
  89. Yeah, we all know how you feel. :P

    Yeah, we all know how you feel. :P
  90. Replies
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    How are you guys even quoting eachother?

    How are you guys even quoting eachother?
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    If I'm not running 5e under AL, I see no reason...

    If I'm not running 5e under AL, I see no reason to opt into feats, myself.
  92. Oh, the arguing, I get. I'm down for a nice...

    Oh, the arguing, I get. I'm down for a nice argument. ;)

    There is a range, yes. How you model a character 'avoiding' the deadly bullets, though, can vary quite a bit. In 5e, the DM could choose...
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    There's no reason to assume that an optional...

    There's no reason to assume that an optional expansion of BM maneuvers would always/only be used in campaigns that opt into feats, so it makes no sense to write them as if feats were assumed, but,...
  94. You only need a long rest to change your prepared...

    You only need a long rest to change your prepared spells - that significantly less foreknowledge than might be implied in choosing feats, features, sub-class & class (a build-at-level really).
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    So a similar maneuver would be a big plus for the...

    So a similar maneuver would be a big plus for the BM in a game w/o feats - and in one with, he might just take the feat, instead.

    Feats are optional rules, afterall, as are MCing, and there's a...
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    You're missing the 1e DMG. ;) Seriously,...

    You're missing the 1e DMG. ;) Seriously, though, if they have water breathing, verbal components should be OK, if you don't pay much attention to material components, continue not to - if you do,...
  97. Wow, guys? Over "can I use my magic elf game to...

    Wow, guys? Over "can I use my magic elf game to play cowboys and ^E^E^E Native Americans?"
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    You could certainly say "better reliability" or,...

    You could certainly say "better reliability" or, really, "better" a lot of other things, like "designed," because reliability /is/ a pretty standard design goal. What good is something that doesn't...
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    Wow, were to start. Simulacra have half the hps...

    Wow, were to start. Simulacra have half the hps and all the abilities, even casting, of the original creature - they don't regain slots or gain levels, but otherwise they exist until killed or...
  100. Yeah, it was kinda a tongue-in-cheek example... I...

    Yeah, it was kinda a tongue-in-cheek example... I should try to be more serious... sometimes...

    ...not right now.
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