D&D 5E If WotC is outsourcing official 5E material to 3PP, What is WotC working on?

Parmandur · May 29, 2019

DEFCON 1 said:
Don't forget you also have Goodman Games who could license doing a re-up of one or all 3 DoD modules at some point too. They chose to do Isle of Dread leading up to stand side-by-side with Ghosts of Saltmarsh, so if at some point WotC does a desert and/or Dark Sun thing but doesn't want to re-do those three themselves... Goodman could perhaps do it instead.

True; I imagine Mearls has a gameplan for which modules WotC wants to do, and which they don't care to bother with, and when.

I don't want to hard on DoD too much, as it was an example in my mind, but it seems like something WotC would want to use for a GoS adventure, since that seems to be working for them: "From the author behind Curse of Strahd!" seems good marketing for the Next Gen gamer. Expedition to Barrier Peak, the next Goodman module, would seem difficult for WotC to use the same way in creating a marketable sandbox.

it also strieks me, having been readign GoS, that an additional such book set in Keoland about swamops and cults, would be very doable: N1, I2 and I7 are all right there, and they could throw I1 in there for fun and giggles if they want to.

Staffan · May 29, 2019

vecna00 said:
Re-reading some of the old comments in this thread four years later has been interesting!

In regards to desert adventures, have there been any that dealt with the return of Shade and its effect on the Anauroch? I remember the novel series, but not any adventures.

There was a 3.5e series of adventures that started with Cormyr: the Tearing of the Weave, continued with Shadowdale: the Scouring of the Land, and culminated with Anauroch: the Empire of Shade. I haven't read and only started playing the first, but they deal with the efforts of the Shadovar and the Church of Shar trying to replace the Weave with the Shadow Weave.

Urriak · May 29, 2019

Parmandur said:
Right, but my point is that WotC isn't thinking "well, this is too similar to that other thing coming, so we shouldn't do that," or TftYP wouldn't have included those particular adventures.

What Stewart said was that "While the 2019 adventure wouldn't explore one of those areas, plans were underway to explore "lots" of different areas that were influenced by different cultures in multiple 2020 books. Stewart added that Wizards of the Coast were hiring consultants to vet the products and storylines." He didn't really specify in the Forgotten Realms: but if the big AP is set in, say, Calishman and involves Genie shenanigans, that would be part of what he means: and if the Spring book is something like Desert of Desolation, that would be a second such exploratory product.

I think what I'm trying to say is that although Wizard's has released books with common threads back-to-back, they haven't actually written anything that's actually that similar back-to-back. Dragon Heist and Ravnica are not the same book, and Storm King's doesn't equal the Yawning Portal, doesn't equal Tomb of Annihilation.

That said, I don't think Dark Sun and DoD are equivalent either, especially as I believe Dark Sun will probably get a Wayfinder's Guide style release for testing anyway.

Just curious, has anyone at WotC actually said they're planning on more module remakes soon? TftYP came out in 2017, Ghosts of Saltmarsh is coming out in 2019. I'm not expecting another "true remake" until 2021 at that pace.

More likely, based upon the Stewart quote, I'm guessing the next AP in 2020 is something in either Calimshan, Zakhara, or Kara-tur.

And just so people can make their guesses more clear;

2015:
2 APs (PotA, OotA), 1 setting book (SCAG).

2016:
2 APs (CoS, SKT), 1 crunch book (VGtM)

2017:
2 APs (TftYP, ToA), 1 crunch (XGtE)

2018:
2 APs (WDH, WDotMM), 1 crunch (MToF), 1 setting (GGtR), 1 setting PDF (WGtE)

2019:
2 APs (GoS, BGDiA), 1 setting (Eberron), 1 starter box.

2020 will probably match the pattern of the past years, being 2 APs, 1 setting, 1 crunch book or starter box.

Parmandur · May 29, 2019

Matthia05718273 said:
I think what I'm trying to say is that although Wizard's has released books with common threads back-to-back, they haven't actually written anything that's actually that similar back-to-back. Dragon Heist and Ravnica are not the same book, and Storm King's doesn't equal the Yawning Portal, doesn't equal Tomb of Annihilation.

That said, I don't think Dark Sun and DoD are equivalent either, especially as I believe Dark Sun will probably get a Wayfinder's Guide style release for testing anyway.

Just curious, has anyone at WotC actually said they're planning on more module remakes soon? TftYP came out in 2017, Ghosts of Saltmarsh is coming out in 2019. I'm not expecting another "true remake" until 2021 at that pace.

More likely, based upon the Stewart quote, I'm guessing the next AP in 2020 is something in either Calimshan, Zakhara, or Kara-tur.

And just so people can make their guesses more clear;

2015:
2 APs (PotA, OotA), 1 setting book (SCAG).

2016:
2 APs (CoS, SKT), 1 crunch book (VGtM)

2017:
2 APs (TftYP, ToA), 1 crunch (XGtE)

2018:
2 APs (WDH, WDotMM), 1 crunch (MToF), 1 setting (GGtR), 1 setting PDF (WGtE)

2019:
2 APs (GoS, BGDiA), 1 setting (Eberron), 1 starter box.

2020 will probably match the pattern of the past years, being 2 APs, 1 setting, 1 crunch book or starter box.

I think we agree on the first part, just from different angles.
We don't know whether they will do another reboot set next year, though it seems like they could easily enough. We do know that they plan not do multiple storylines annually in the future, and that Waterdeep being a two-book storyline appears to not have been their original plan for the AP (it seems that Dragon Heist as intro chapter mutated and went rogue, and the Dungeon was too big anyways). Perkins wasn't able to keep it up after Strahd/SKT, so I think if they do have another AP next year, it will be more low key narrative-wise like GoS or TftYP (which I wouldn't even call APs the same way).

If Eberron hits it big this year, I can see an annual setting being a thing and subsuming the crunch/monster books. So, one reprint low-key adventure book, one big splashy story book, and one crunch and monster bearing setting book per year would seem reasonable.

Urriak · May 29, 2019

Parmandur said:
I think we agree on the first part, just from different angles.
We don't know whether they will do another reboot set next year, though it seems like they could easily enough. We do know that they plan not do multiple storylines annually in the future, and that Waterdeep being a two-book storyline appears to not have been their original plan for the AP (it seems that Dragon Heist as intro chapter mutated and went rogue, and the Dungeon was too big anyways). Perkins wasn't able to keep it up after Strahd/SKT, so I think if they do have another AP next year, it will be more low key narrative-wise like GoS or TftYP (which I wouldn't even call APs the same way).

If Eberron hits it big this year, I can see an annual setting being a thing and subsuming the crunch/monster books. So, one reprint low-key adventure book, one big splashy story book, and one crunch and monster bearing setting book per year would seem reasonable.

I'm not entirely sure about this so correct me if I'm wrong, but is Perkin's being unable to make two APs single-handedly a year really a problem anymore? I mean they got Adam Lee as narrative designer, and Mike Mearls. And even the game designers like Crawford and Kate Welch seem pretty intimate with the story (Welch has said she actually does art orders too).

You do make a good point though, I didn't realize that the past couple of years aren't technically two APs in the traditional sense. Do people keep bringing up DoD because WotC has hinted at it?

Parmandur · May 30, 2019

Matthia05718273 said:
I'm not entirely sure about this so correct me if I'm wrong, but is Perkin's being unable to make two APs single-handedly a year really a problem anymore? I mean they got Adam Lee as narrative designer, and Mike Mearls. And even the game designers like Crawford and Kate Welch seem pretty intimate with the story (Welch has said she actually does art orders too).

You do make a good point though, I didn't realize that the past couple of years aren't technically two APs in the traditional sense. Do people keep bringing up DoD because WotC has hinted at it?

That's a point about the extra designers (Ari, too), but they may still keep the splashy multimedia stories to one a year, as they also were coming out too fast for business partners like video games and GaleForce 9 to keep up, per Perkins.

They haven't said anything about DoD specifically; I brought it up as an example of old time adventures +that I know about) that could he the basis of a similar book to GoS. I'm certain examples could easily be multiplied.

Parmandur · May 30, 2019

One might also consider Curse of Strahd and Dungeon of the Mad Mage as being more like GoS, in some ways, for that matter....

gyor · May 30, 2019

Matthia05718273 said:
I think what I'm trying to say is that although Wizard's has released books with common threads back-to-back, they haven't actually written anything that's actually that similar back-to-back. Dragon Heist and Ravnica are not the same book, and Storm King's doesn't equal the Yawning Portal, doesn't equal Tomb of Annihilation.

That said, I don't think Dark Sun and DoD are equivalent either, especially as I believe Dark Sun will probably get a Wayfinder's Guide style release for testing anyway.

Just curious, has anyone at WotC actually said they're planning on more module remakes soon? TftYP came out in 2017, Ghosts of Saltmarsh is coming out in 2019. I'm not expecting another "true remake" until 2021 at that pace.

More likely, based upon the Stewart quote, I'm guessing the next AP in 2020 is something in either Calimshan, Zakhara, or Kara-tur.

And just so people can make their guesses more clear;

2015:
2 APs (PotA, OotA), 1 setting book (SCAG).

2016:
2 APs (CoS, SKT), 1 crunch book (VGtM)

2017:
2 APs (TftYP, ToA), 1 crunch (XGtE)

2018:
2 APs (WDH, WDotMM), 1 crunch (MToF), 1 setting (GGtR), 1 setting PDF (WGtE)

2019:
2 APs (GoS, BGDiA), 1 setting (Eberron), 1 starter box.

2020 will probably match the pattern of the past years, being 2 APs, 1 setting, 1 crunch book or starter box.

No crutch book this year for me is a shocker, it's been a disappointing year for content honestly IMO. No MTOF style book, no VGTM style book, no XGTE style book, nothing.

Hopefully it means they have something major planned for 2020.

Well at least I have Odyssey of the Dragonlords to look forward too.

Desert of Desolation would fit in with Nathan's statement too, it's Egyptian and Arab themed, maybe with some East Indian in there too with the Durpari, it's very Euro centric part of the realms. And I expect Kara Tur and Zakhara will require something broader then an AP, both are massive continents, especially Kara Tur. Two China's, two Japan's, a Korea, Tibet, Siberia, Indoneasia and Philippines, Cambodia, Vietnam, Hill Tribes, Mongolia, and some other explored regions. It gets bigger if you include the Utter East where the Bloodforge wars occurred.

Parmandur · May 30, 2019

gyor said:
No crutch book this year for me is a shocker, it's been a disappointing year for content honestly IMO. No MTOF style book, no VGTM style book, no XGTE style book, nothing.

Hopefully it means they have something major planned for 2020.

Well at least I have Odyssey of the Dragonlords to look forward too.

Desert of Desolation would fit in with Nathan's statement too, it's Egyptian and Arab themed, maybe with some East Indian in there too with the Durpari, it's very Euro centric part of the realms. And I expect Kara Tur and Zakhara will require something broader then an AP, both are massive continents, especially Kara Tur. Two China's, two Japan's, a Korea, Tibet, Siberia, Indoneasia and Philippines, Cambodia, Vietnam, Hill Tribes, Mongolia, and some other explored regions. It gets bigger if you include the Utter East where the Bloodforge wars occurred.

About a crunch book, think about it this way: what would such a book include? Player options, DM modules, and monsters. What is the Eberron book likely to include? Player options, DM modules, and monsters.

Staffan · May 30, 2019

Minor beef: I wish people would stop calling Wizards of the Coast's adventures "Adventure paths". They are adventures - big ones, certainly, but still adventures. A path consists of many steps - the only thing they've offered so far in print that I'd consider an adventure path is Tyranny of Dragons (though a two-part path is pretty slim). I'm not sure I'd consider Waterdeep to be one - as I understand it there's no real connection between Dragon Heist and Dungeon of the Mad Mage other than both being linked to Waterdeep.