D&D 5E What's the point of gold?

delericho

Legend
I definitely recall that the monsters seemed to get deadlier as more MMs came out, although one core example of highly deadly creatures were the MM1 dragons.

Yep. The dragons were deliberately made more deadly than their CR would indicate, with the view that they should represent a greater-than-normal threat. With the net effect that this made the CR measure even less useful and making it harder for DMs to judge the difficulty of encounters they design. Not the designers' very best move.
 

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PnPgamer

Explorer
It got to the point in my Pathfinder game that a PC interested in fixing up a broken manor home (about 2k in repairs) was chastised by another player for wasting gold on that when he could buy a +1 weapon with it.

That kind of thinking is why I hate craft/shop anything magical rules.

You have to blame that on the system itself actually. The PC's suffer a real blow to their powerlevel if they don't spend all their gold on magical gear, always. This is pretty much true to 3rd, 4th and pathfinder.
 
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miatoromatic

First Post
Does all of this talk about the stark contrast between PC optimization and monster scaling apply to 5E, then?

I have been supplementing the player's optimization with magic items that have some utility in combat that's not a straight up +1 to help improve their creativity and design encounters around that
 

delericho

Legend
Does all of this talk about the stark contrast between PC optimization and monster scaling apply to 5E, then?

That's a big question. The design team have said that the game is designed assuming that PCs don't have items and that any items they do have are a bonus (but, further, that with Bounded Accuracy any magic items should not skew the math too much).

But as for what actually happens, that's a big unknown. Initial indications are good, partly because 5e appears to very deliberately not have the same obsession with balance as its predecessors.
 

Blackbrrd

First Post
I have only DM-ed 5e up to level 4 and haven't given out any magic items, but so far they haven't had too many problems. Creative players and good strategy/tactics seem to help out a lot.
 

bedir than

Full Moon Storyteller
Most adventurers will shoot for the "Comfortable" lifestyle (small cottage or private room), which is 2gp per day. So the PCs go on an adventure for a week and each returns with 600 gp. This means they can enjoy the good life for 10 months. After that, they have to go at it again. If you keep this rhythm, the PCs are going on an adventure almost once per year, which might be realistic (if not exactly exciting).

You might couple that with Training, adding another 250 gp to the cost above, and the PCs will spend 850 every 10 months, and come out of their downtime with a new language or tool proficiency.

This assumes no yearning for power and influence in the world besides just "kill stuff." Become a Lord, or Bishop, Guildmaster, Headmaster, etc involves a lot of expenses (that you really create once and just becomes a per day/month/year for your campaign) and the player does not just get role play bonuses, but reasons to adventure and hirelings that can do stuff for them (maybe even be lower level PCs to send on minor adventures because raiding that three cave system is just too petty for the Baron of Westmarshwilderlands).

Gold is awesome. Characters have needs. Need to bribe someone? Gold. Need to travel by ship to the Green Isle? Gold. Need a resurrection and your characters aren't powerful? Find a powerful cleric give them gold/quest. Tired of traveling by foot? Gold and you have a horse. Find too much crap to carry back to your lair? Glad you spent that gold on the mule. Your mule was eaten? Buy another one.

Social and Exploration pillars make gold vital. Even in combat gold enables better equipment. Sure, you topped out on your platemail and your fancy but non-magical sword that your DM decides is keen and so +1 but not magical. But you are about to attack a huge fortress and their are four of you with a beast companion and a familiar and there are about 500 goblins living there. You have tons of gold and they will fight you and kill your families (whatever, this is just a quick thought).

You go back to town, say we need a couple catapults, etc and 50 of your finest men/women/whosists and we are ridding this land of that Goblin horde.

Gold is for whatever you want to spend it on and you're going to get a lot of it. Your character probably has dreams that involve money, nearly everyone does.

The party I DM for is a mix of 7 players that usually only has 4-5 drop in at a time. It is episodic. They vary only from 2nd to 3rd level and they've only gotten a few GP each. They are left wanting more, because they are starting to worry about how they'll repair their stuff, replace ammunition, etc. But they're in the wilderness, why would a raiding party have 100% of their wealth on them?

They'll find a lair soon and then have more than they can carry. Tough choices to come.
 

Remathilis

Legend
You have to blame that on the system itself actually. The PC's suffer a real blow to their powerlevel if they don't spend all their gold on magical gear, always. This is pretty much true to 3rd, 4th and pathfinder.

Oddly, It did and it didn't.

In principle, you are correct. As optimizers spent every last copper eeking out another +1, gold stopped being about daily expenditures (such as carousing or building things) and much more on "Hey, I have 3,000 gp on my char sheet. I wonder what magic do-hickey I can buy for that?" My players are NOT optimizers, but even they fell into that trap.

That said, In the long run, they ended up doing just fine. Might be because by pure luck they picked some of the strongest classes in PF (cleric, paladin, summoner, rogue/gunslinger, dervish bard and a two-weapon fighter kinda bringing up the rear) and because they really do a good job of aiding one another out. They've proven to be very hard to kill (not that I'm trying...) often taking on things 5 over their CR without casualty. Each one has some expenditure they deal with (thieves guilds, homes, spell research, a shop, etc) which sucks out some of their gold, yet they remain completely above their expected CR range. (Granted, each spends maybe a hundred or so GP per month on these things, pocket change when you're 9th level).

So even when spending most of their gold on magical crap, they did manage to spend some frivolously and still be impossible to kill. I'm sure there is more than WPL to account for that, but I can honestly say that if my group were heavy optimizers (optimum feats, archetypes, and spells) and then spent every GP wisely, they'd be taking on balors at level 12!
 


Riley37

First Post
I'm kinda disappointed that no one has, so far, seriously answered any of the questions I've raised.

What loot did Achilles and Odysseus gain?
What magic items did they buy?

What loot did King Arthur gain?
What magic items did he buy?

Do you even recognize those names?
Are you aware of the genre of stories, "heroic fantasy"?
Is there now, or was there ever, any connection between D&D, and heroic fantasy?
WHERE THE F$%@! did you get the idea that anyone ever buys magic items in heroic fantasy stories?
 

Kikuras

First Post
I'm kinda disappointed that no one has, so far, seriously answered any of the questions I've raised.

What loot did Achilles and Odysseus gain?
What magic items did they buy?

What loot did King Arthur gain?
What magic items did he buy?

Do you even recognize those names?
Are you aware of the genre of stories, "heroic fantasy"?
Is there now, or was there ever, any connection between D&D, and heroic fantasy?
WHERE THE F$%@! did you get the idea that anyone ever buys magic items in heroic fantasy stories?

To be fair, in the heroic fantasy stories it's pretty much essential that the hero finds magic that they can use, i.e. King Arthur was proficient with a sword, and it really matched his character build, so he gets magic swords. Perseus was handed all sorts of cool magical stuff.

Achilles died 'mid-adventure', though there may be some suggestion of past glories netting him some good loot, and it's pretty safe to assume that Odysseus walked away from Troy with some decent loot, even if Homer didn't attach a receipt as Appendix A.

True about the buying/selling of magic items though.
 

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