Crafting items

rumble · Jun 11, 2003

I have a player who wants to make a bow. Actually, a bunch of bows. So I looked up the rules.

Summary

DIFFICULTY CLASS TO CREATE
DC for regular bows is 12
DC for mighty bow +2 is 19

COST TO CREATE SINGLE BOW
Cost of bow is 1/3 price in raw materials.
regular bow is ~25 gp materials
mighty bow +2 is ~100 gp materials

TIME TO CREATE A SINGLE BOW
1) Time to create is determined by calculating cost of item in silver.
regular bow is ~750 sp
mighty bow +2 is ~3000 sp

2) Roll a skill check each week.
If you fail the DC, you make no progress. If you fail by 5 or more, you lose half your raw materials and must go through another gathering process.

If you make the DC check, take the check result, and multiply by the DC. If the total exceeds the sp cost of the item, you're done. If not, repeat the skill check and add the total to the previous week's effort.

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Now, we're playing in the Midnight setting, so he's pretty much got to forage in the wild for all his materials. You can't (usually) just wander out and buy supplies.

My questions (actually his questions):

1) Is it really this crazy? With regular check results of 20 it takes over THREE WEEKS to make a single bow? It gets worse -- much worse -- when you try to make a mighty bow.

2) If you're in the wild, and trying to collect supplies, how quickly can you do it, and how would you adjudicate such a collection process?

He's frustrated, and I'm puzzled as to how this can be so difficult. Midnight already screws you plenty, and I'd like to run this game "by the rules," but this seems very harsh.

Help?

Maitre Du Donjon · Jun 11, 2003

rumble said:
Edit: [snip] (picky picky picky Otterscrubber)

I don't really know about the Midnight setting, but

1) Yes, this is the way to do it... it'll take him a little more than 3 weeks to make his bow (assuming checks of 20 each week). It'll take him a little less than 8 weeks to make the mighty bow (+2).

Is the character in a hurry? 3 weeks can go by really quick if the DM permits it

Compare it to the other use of the skill, that states that you can make about half your check in gold in a week. A 20 check would bring in about 10 gold. The character would have to work for 7,5 weeks to make enough money to buy his bow...

2) I'm not sure there are rules to bypass the fact that you need to pay 1/3 of the total cost of the item in raw materials.

What you could do (just an idea on the top of my head) is add the cost of raw materials to the price of them item to determine the time taken to make the bow. For the regular bow (for example), you could say that he needs to craft the equivalent of a 100gp item (75 gp + 25 gp raw cost), which would take him a little more than 4 weeks. When craft checks are missed by 5 or more, that cost would have to be added to the total cost of the item.

As for the player's frustration, if the other players don't mind having 3 weeks of free time, then, like i said, 3 weeks (or 8) can go by real quick... Other characters could use that time to make scrolls, make a little money by exercing a profession or a craft of their own, etc.

Good luck!

Maitre D

Storm Raven · Jun 11, 2003

rumble said:
DIFFICULTY CLASS TO CREATE
DC for regular bows is 12
DC for mighty bow +2 is 19

Only composite bows can be mighty bows. The DC for a composite bow is 15, not 12.

If you fail the DC, you make no progress. If you fail by 5 or more, you lose half your raw materials and must go through another gathering process.

Most individuals crafting items "take 10" on their weekly Craft check. It makes this sort of thing much less risky and makes calculation easy.

1) Is it really this crazy? With regular check results of 20 it takes over THREE WEEKS to make a single bow? It gets worse -- much worse -- when you try to make a mighty bow.

How easy do you think it is to make a combat useful longbow or composite longbow? These are not simple, easy to make items.

rumble · Jun 11, 2003

Re: Re: Crafting items

Storm Raven said:
How easy do you think it is to make a combat useful longbow or composite longbow?

If I knew the answer to that question, I certainly wouldn't have bothered asking, would I?

Yes, yes, I know it was rhetorical.

As for materials, I wasn't asking how to bypass the need for materials . . .

Rather, I'm asking:

If money is worthless, and you actually have to collect your own raw materials, how would you go about it, by the rules?

I'm thinking, tentatively, that if a Craft skill can produce half your skill check result in gp/week, a Wilderness Lore or a Search check may be able to function this way to collect raw materials in the wild.

Thoughts?

Otterscrubber · Jun 11, 2003

Is it really necessary to quote someone's entire post in your post if their entire post is the one previous to yours? Just an observation.

smetzger · Jun 11, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Crafting items

rumble said:
If money is worthless, and you actually have to collect your own raw materials, how would you go about it, by the rules?

I'm thinking, tentatively, that if a Craft skill can produce half your skill check result in gp/week, a Wilderness Lore or a Search check may be able to function this way to collect raw materials in the wild.

Yup, thats what I would do. Probably allow Knowledge Nature for Synergy bonus.

Storm Raven · Jun 11, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Crafting items

rumble said:
If I knew the answer to that question, I certainly wouldn't have bothered asking, would I?

It is diffuclt. If anything, three weeks may be too short for some types of bows.

Gwarok · Jun 11, 2003

Where do these lists exist for how much time it takes to craft things? I wish to have my character as a jeweler who makes items fit for kings. I am not sure the best way to translate this to game. Also I have no idea the cost of raw stones as opposed to finished gems. Anyone with info on this would be appreciated.

rumble · Jun 11, 2003

Gwarok said:
Where do these lists exist for how much time it takes to craft things? . . . Also I have no idea the cost of raw stones as opposed to finished gems.

Determining crafting times and resolving other crafting issues are covered on pages 65-66 of the Player's Handbook under the Craft skill description.

Consider that the cost of raw stones is simply the raw materials for finished gems. In that case, raw stones would cost 1/3 the cost of the finished gem, just as any other raw materials used in item creation.

Gwarok · Jun 11, 2003

Yea but those pages list a static amount in SP x DC x Total # rolled+Skill mod. This is regardless of the skill in question. For things like jewelry it would take months to complete even a ring, and thats simply not the case. A real piece of jewelry like a crown would take ages.