D&D 5E Mearls' "Firing" tweet

Dannyalcatraz · Jul 2, 2019

Scrivener of Doom said:
Ahhh, yes, Americans.

The only nation in the world where most of its population are monolingual in their second language.

Keep yukkin’ it up, and we’ll launch another wave of culture bombs at you. Dallas, Baywatch, NFL/MLB games, Jersey Shore, the Dumb & Dumber franchise*...you think that’s all we got?

* let that last one sink in for a bit.

Hussar · Jul 2, 2019

doctorbadwolf said:
Also, do folks think that the actual mechanics of 5e have literally nothing to do with its popularity and incredible success?

Well, of course not. Since most of the mechanics were cribbed from 4e, admitting that 5e's mechanics are the reason for 5e's popularity would require folks to admit that 4e had some good ideas and that's just not going to happen.

Sadras · Jul 2, 2019

Dannyalcatraz said:
Keep yukkin’ it up, and we’ll launch another wave of culture bombs at you. Dallas, Baywatch, NFL/MLB games, Jersey Shore, the Dumb & Dumber franchise*...you think that’s all we got?

* let that last one sink in for a bit.

Well played sir!

Remathilis · Jul 2, 2019

"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore."

- James Nicoll

Remathilis · Jul 2, 2019

Dungeonosophy said:
Here's what I'd like to see Mike Mearls and WotC do:

In regard to Rules Complexity:

For 6E, turn D&D into a game which basically no more complex than The Black Hack. Really. Start with only one Power (spell, proficiency, class feature, feat or racial trait). Turn everything into simple "Skills & Powers". It doesn't even have to be "balanced." Gain one Power per level. Super simple. But not white bread generic like the existing Basic Rules PDF, which reads like software code. And make all classes, races, spells, monsters, and items available, but super simplified. Really juice up the Power descriptions and titles, to match what characters can do in D&D novels.

In regard to Lore Density:

But at the same time, release a complete series of gigantic hardcover compendium books from star, which include literally all spells (Spell Compendium), all magic items (Encyclopedia Magica), and all monsters (Monster Manual, ala Echohawk)...FROM ALL EDITIONS. From the start, like in the first year of 6E release. Along with an Atlas of the D&D Multiverse with world maps for all previously-published D&D worlds (ala Karen Wynn Fonstads' atlases of Krynn and Toril). And a Timeline of the D&D Multiverse (ala Brian James FR work), synchonizing all the worlds' timelines, and getting them all up to speed. And a Who's Who's of the D&D Multiverse (aka Shady Dragon Inn) with all iconic characters and NPCs from all editions, from all D&D modules, novels, comic books, boardgames, and videogames...Bargle, Drizzt, Aleena, Regdar, Tasselhoff, everybody!

And drastically lower the prices of the Classic PDFs, and push them as bundles which cover *everything* ever written about each D&D World. So newcomers can brush up and become loremasters without breaking the bank.

And at the same time, make a sandbox-style Worldbuilders Guide the default campaign...a sort of "un-setting."

The streamlined game + accessibility of the lore, pleases beginners and grognards, sandboxers and loremasters, at the same time!

But if really want a super-complex iteration too, then also have an Advanced D&D 6E, and support both BD&D 6E and AD&D 6E with dual-stats in all products. Ideally, they. But keep them separate.

Furthermore, to grow the player network even more, I'd suggest the sacriligeous but humble route of WotC simply adopting Pathfinder Second Edition whole cloth for AD&D 6E. Just relable it D&D 6E and add in the "missing" iconic D&D races/classes (including 1.5E Unearthed Arcana): Tiefling, Dragonborn, Svirfniblin, Drow, Warlock, Warlord, Cavalier, Acrobat.

That is the surefire best way to kill D&D stone-dead and leave its fading IP the cheap backdrop for freemium phone games and nostalgic t-shirts.

Sacrosanct · Jul 2, 2019

Hussar said:
Well, of course not. Since most of the mechanics were cribbed from 4e, admitting that 5e's mechanics are the reason for 5e's popularity would require folks to admit that 4e had some good ideas and that's just not going to happen.

Not according to 4e fans when 5e came out. When it did come out, these forums were full of 4e fans who said they were “forsaken” by WoTC. And betrayed. And lied to because Mearls said 5e would have elements of every edition and 5e didn’t take anything from 4e.

So it would be odd that 4e fans took that position then, and would take your position now since they are opposite positions.

doctorbadwolf · Jul 2, 2019

Sacrosanct said:
Not according to 4e fans when 5e came out. When it did come out, these forums were full of 4e fans who said they were “forsaken” by WoTC. And betrayed. And lied to because Mearls said 5e would have elements of every edition and 5e didn’t take anything from 4e.

So it would be odd that 4e fans took that position then, and would take your position now since they are opposite positions.

Or, maybe, hussar isn’t a representative of every other 4e fan ever. Possibly. It is entirely possible, indeed, that each individual person has their own point of view on any given thing, and true monoliths are rare to the point of effective non-existence.

Snark aside, POVs change over time, and not everyone felt that way even during the time to which you refer. It’s not odd at all, it’s just how life works.

Charlaquin · Jul 2, 2019

Sacrosanct said:
Not according to 4e fans when 5e came out. When it did come out, these forums were full of 4e fans who said they were “forsaken” by WoTC. And betrayed. And lied to because Mearls said 5e would have elements of every edition and 5e didn’t take anything from 4e.

So it would be odd that 4e fans took that position then, and would take your position now since they are opposite positions.

There are a number things 5e definitely borrowed from 4e. Almost all of them were actively obfuscated (see minor actions being rebranded as “bonus actions,” for example), and the overall design philosophy was very much a departure from 4e. And WotC absolutely overpromised re: 5e being able to emulate the play experience of any previous edition, even at the same table. I think a fair bit of the 4e fan upset at the end of the playtest and launch of 5e had more to do with the elements of 4e that the upset individuals considered definitive of the 4e play experience were not, in fact, emulated by 5e, rather than 5e genuinely not taking anything from 4e.

Heck, I’m still pretty annoyed that the modularity they were peddling at the beginning of the playtest ended up consisting of “have you looked at the Battlemaster? That’s kind of like a 4e character!”

No, Jeremy. No, it’s not.

Hussar · Jul 2, 2019

Sacrosanct said:
Not according to 4e fans when 5e came out. When it did come out, these forums were full of 4e fans who said they were “forsaken” by WoTC. And betrayed. And lied to because Mearls said 5e would have elements of every edition and 5e didn’t take anything from 4e.

So it would be odd that 4e fans took that position then, and would take your position now since they are opposite positions.

That died down very, very quickly outside of a poster or two (hello Mr. V). I certainly didn't see the forums as "full of 4e fans". I saw some quibbling that very quickly disappeared. But, again, we've all got our own bias filters.

cbwjm · Jul 2, 2019

Charlaquin said:
There are a number things 5e definitely borrowed from 4e. Almost all of them were actively obfuscated (see minor actions being rebranded as “bonus actions,” for example)

Don't you mean 3.5s swift action being rebranded as "bonus actions"?