Ravnica: Is This The New D&D Setting? [UPDATED & CONFIRMED!]

Mercurius said:

While I hope this is true, I think it is wishful thinking. More realistically we get one, maybe two, classic setting PDFs per year.

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I think it likely that many of these start as PDFs until there is playtesting and they become final. Then you may have a Print on Demand option for those that got the earlier PDF version and it's updates. When it's final a regular hardback might be available.

Philip F Goding said:

I think it likely that many of these start as PDFs until there is playtesting and they become final. Then you may have a Print on Demand option for those that got the earlier PDF version and it's updates. When it's final a regular hardback might be available.

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I agree, I was more talking about the above poster's speculation that they might come out with three setting books (or PDFs) per year.

I agree with you longer post above, for the most part, that WotC will work their way down the list of classic settings in some order, with some getting the "Eberron Treatment" of PDF-to-POD and some being incorporated into a story arc. We might also see further Magic settings, if Ravnica is successful.

What remains unclear to me, and perhaps to WotC, is whether or not they'll publish hardcover versions of the PDF settings. I would think they might do it for a select few but not for most.

I must ask: why do you need a 5e upgrade on classical settings at all other than for unsolved mechanical issues (e.g. Psionics, Thri kreen, half giant etc.) ?

Do you need a new story? Most of the published 5e material is adaptable somehow.

Do you need advice for shoehorning dragonborn into greyhawk? Thou aren't following a worthy cause then

So what is it besides some rules for mechanic oddities like defiling or a psion class that you need?

I mean if you are of the sort that needs everything printed to the letter in an adventure, then you would need the complete thing.
Say, if you would be unable somehow to even convert some of the starter adventures from 1e or 2e, then you really would need the full package for a setting ,including some 1-20 campaign, maybe some adventurers guide or mordenkaninens tome or whatever also. That is not very likely to happen for most of the old stuff and there is tons of convertible adventures around, so what are your expectations?

Who are you writing to, [MENTION=6895991]Coroc[/MENTION]? If you're writing to me (as your post was right after mine), pretty much none of your post applies as I don't "need" any of those things as I never run games in published settings, always homebrews. I like setting books for reading and collecting pleasure and to get ideas from. My preference is almost always for new settings rather than old ones - so I was one of the folks who was pleasantly surprised about the Ravnica announcement and would prefer, for example, to see a Nerath book than a Greyhawk one.

That said, I'd enjoy seeing new versions of certain settings, because I like setting books.

[MENTION=59082]Mercurius[/MENTION] No, my post was more generally not directed at you specifically, maybe a bit of thread hijacking on my side as so many speculations were going on in this thread on what comes next and why, I thought it might be the best place to ask such a question.

I think most people just want more people to get to know the settings they love and that's why they ask for updated version :

new players or even not that new won't go and do conversion from old books they might not have just because some old( or less old ) fogey like us just said Greyhawk or Dragonlance are the best settings.

Even myself, I'm hyped at Ravnica because it's a setting I've played in or made play and I just love it and would love for people to get hooked on it as I am.

And that's why people request for it. ( also and just simply because they love and cherish the setting )

Coroc said:

I must ask: why do you need a 5e upgrade on classical settings at all other than for unsolved mechanical issues (e.g. Psionics, Thri kreen, half giant etc.) ?

Do you need a new story? Most of the published 5e material is adaptable somehow.

Do you need advice for shoehorning dragonborn into greyhawk? Thou aren't following a worthy cause then

So what is it besides some rules for mechanic oddities like defiling or a psion class that you need?

I mean if you are of the sort that needs everything printed to the letter in an adventure, then you would need the complete thing.
Say, if you would be unable somehow to even convert some of the starter adventures from 1e or 2e, then you really would need the full package for a setting ,including some 1-20 campaign, maybe some adventurers guide or mordenkaninens tome or whatever also. That is not very likely to happen for most of the old stuff and there is tons of convertible adventures around, so what are your expectations?

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I certainly do not need Dragonborn in Greyhawk. I don't actually need 5e product at all. It all goes back to how things were in the 1970's and '80's with D&D when we were starting out and using modules they supplied as the basis of things and experimenting with changes. In those days these super modules didn't exist. Adventures came out in usually three or four parts. You would play through part one and then wait months or even years for the next part. To satisfy players you either had to make a lot of stuff up or go on to some other story. In the end most of them saw completion, but there were things that were never completed. We might see unconnected pieces or you might just hear about things. That was true in Greyhawk, Blackmoor and Kalibruhn and these were connected to E Gary Gygax, Dave Arneson and Rob Kuntz.

There was in the Holmes Basic D&D book the first level of an adventure called The Tower of Zenopus. That is the very first dungeon my very first character set foot in. This was Maxwell the Magic-User and I ran that for other players when I was starting out as DM because I was the only one who ever played before, but where to go from there. At first I had B1 In Search of The Unknown and B2 The Keep on The Borderlands. On the B2 map there was a Cave of the Unknown that was not detailed. To make do we put these three things together. Then there was T1 The Village of Hommlet and it was years before T1-4 The Temple of Elemental Evil came out. By then it was too late. Still it was closure and that's the thing closure or the sense of completion. There was a mystery that nagged and you wanted to know hoe it was. L1 The Secret of Bone Hill same thing... and so one.

The Holy Grail though is Castle Greyhawk and the Rob Kuntz side of it called El Raja Key. Pieces of these have come out over the decades often in obscure blink and you miss them places. This being the way it was because the relationships between TSR (now WotC) and these three became difficult. Castle Greyhawk is the original Castle of the Mad Arch Mage and within this castle down in the deeper depths besides there being a bottomless pit to China were portals leading to other worlds and other realities. I guess I could use a place like Sigil for this, but I eventually created as a place holder my own Dark Tower as the products that TSR/WotC came outwith to satisfy this didn't satisfy. Gary was in the midst of putting out Castle Zagyg when he passed away and all work on this stopped perhaps forever.

I want to see the original works of Gary, Rob and Dave either in their OD&D state or updated for play in any edition. I want this so I can integrate it with existing materials and then move forward to new adventures with this there. It's like taking the DNA of dinosaurs and finding there are missing pieces and filling it in with frog DNA, which is what I have done. It is pretty much a dinosaur, but not exactly and you really don't know exactly how it's not. It just nags and I'd like to shut the door on it.

This being said I think the Dungeon of the Mad Mage goes some distance towards bridging the gap. I'll have to wait and see how much and how I'll feel then. There is a Grognard out there that did his own Castle of the Mad Arch Mage that is in the spirit of Gary's original at least. I'd like to say one of our earliest and most successful characters was named Grog back then. He also was a Magic-User like Maxwell. Anyway the more material out there the more I have that I can splice together. I don't even have all that Gary, Rob and Dave have put out. Some of it I can't get at a reasonable price or I just can't find parts of it at all. What I have found typically is in an OD&D format, but some things are for other editions. Sometimes I am amazed with things people found that I never knew even existed. This is all piecing together history.

I am pretty happy with what WotC is doing, but the top item, is bridging the gap with the first D&D families and I think they want to do this and not just because some of the fans want it, but I think it brings us back full circle and helps bring closure for many.

Marvel still respects Stan Lee and I feel that one of the things DC did wrong back in the day was cit ties with Gardner Fox and TSR did that with Gary, Rob and Dave too to varying degrees. I think that's always been a mistake. I think community development in D&D means unity in diversity. We don't all have to agree on settings to get along. We also don't need to be gatekeepers of the rules or continuity or what is canon as we can all homebrew and vary from the rules as much as we like. It's all about the story that we collaborate with our players on and the fun of it. If we all had a good time who cares that we messed up somewhere. Nobody's perfect and we learn to do better next time.

Philip F Goding said:

I pretty much agree although I don't think we can count on any set gap between settings. First of all there is already some Greyhawk setting specific adventures out there. Then with the Plain Shift materials coming out we already have five of those M:TG settings out there in some form and I'm sure they are still putting the fine tunings on Ravnica and there are other M:TG settings being worked on.

Eberron is in a playtest form that they seem to really be pushing now. Who knows when the final version of that will be done. It could be ready before or after Ravnica or even the same time. Spelljammer is technically a way to travel between the Prime Material Planes different settings even though it's something of it's own setting as well. Planescape involves traveling between the various planes, but you could conceivably travel to different settings in the Prime Material Plane as well. Looks as if you can do this at the Yawning Portal or some other gateways/portals doors in the Undermountain or if you could get to Sigil.

They have spoken about Eberron as if the Crystal bubble surrounding Eberronspace has locked people in that setting in and other setting out, but that this is changing as shards fall to ground and cracks appear. That to me is quite interesting, so I see aspects of Spelljammer and Planescape being worked on and appearing.

I would say that setting such as Dragonlance and Dark Sun are likely to come along following Ravnica and Eberron and then Spelljammer and Planescape. Mystara and Greyhawk go way back and will no doubt along at some point. I think they plan on Dominaria coming up before too long and other M:TG settings as we go down through the list of those. Just as we go down the list of D&D settings.

Some settings that have come out before may have rights issues attached to them so I wonder if there will be some 3rd party support product settings come out at some point. I hope for some collaboration deals to be worked out with some of these as unity seems to be helping D&D a lot these days and division seems to hurt.

Some settings such as Al Qadim, Maztica, Kara Tur, Malatra and The Horde are just different areas that we know are just on the same planet as Faerun and Chult and just involve normal travel. Similarly Savage Coast and Hollow Earth are part of Mystara.

I don't know much about Nentir Vale a default 4th edition setting that I don't think got that much play. It seems to be some sort of cross between Forgotten Realms and Greyhawk. As for Birthright, I don't know much about that either, but some folk seem to love it.

As we go down the list I'm sure the more obscure settings won't get a lot of love for a while if ever and there are planty of them. I expect we will be on to another edition before WotC exhausts them all. We may see one or two completely new settings in a way similar to how they came upon Forgetten Realms and Eberron. All new settings fill a niche of interest among fans.

Some of the settings that I wondser about rights issues, but have had connections with D&D in the past include Blackmoor, Kalibruhn (Rob Kuntz), Lankhmar, Kalamar, Rokugon (Legend of the Five Rings), Hyborean Age, Melnibone, Tekumel (Empire of the Petal Throne) and so many others. You could just go down a list of mythologies in our own history with setting based in Norse Mythology, Egyptian Mythology, Greek Mythology, Roman Mythology, Celtic Mythology, Japanese, Chinese, American Indian, Arthurian, Central and South American, Judeo-Christian, Hindu, Zoroastrian, Babylonian and Sumerian, African and so forth. There is no lack of settings based on books or movies or comics even. There is the cosmic horror of Lovecraft, Middle Earth of Tolkien, The Land of Stephen Donaldson's Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever, Elfquest of Richard and Wendy Pini, the cartoon Pirates of Dark Water. Those are just a few of what I've taken from. I've used everything from Alien to Zardoz. All that stops WotC is working out deals with whomsover owns the rights.

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I honestly thought Dominaria was going to be the next D&D setting hard cover treatment, but then the planeshift article was released.

So I don't know which MtG setting will get the official hardcover treatment instead of a volunteer planeshift article next. Maybe Alara.

gyor said:

I honestly thought Dominaria was going to be the next D&D setting hard cover treatment, but then the planeshift article was released.

So I don't know which MtG setting will get the official hardcover treatment instead of a volunteer planeshift article next. Maybe Alara.

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Depends on how this product does if it sells well more will probbably be released, if not it will be considered a failed experiment. It most likely will be Alara or a revisited Zendikar/Inastrad. Dominaria wont happen because it has to directly compete with the Realms and they are both pretty similar

This is a reply I struggled with making, because some of the prior posts I've seen have reminded me just how much I don't like Greyhawk and I really don't want to be bashing... so, I'll try to accentuate the positive.

This is, honestly, really exciting news to me. I've been craving a break from the Forgotten Realms for ages now, and I've always found Magic's worlds fascinating in an abstract "I don't have the money to buy the cards, and the lore should be more available" kind of way. Ravnica is the kind of high fantasy setting I crave - I cut my teeth on the D&D cartoon and on Conan the Adventurer, I will always associate "fantasy" with weird vistas and monsters and magic integral to the world. Ravnica is the kind of thing I WANT out of my D&D, not low-power, low-fantasy "realistic" grim and muck.

The more I learn about Ravnica, the more fascinated I become. I've seen the comparisons to Sigil, and, frankly, whilst I find it annoying that Sigil has become conflated with Planescape (I think that arguably shows how badly Planescape was designed), I think Ravnica does the "Sigil only" campaign better than Sigil does. I don't have problems buying a magical cityscape, any more than I'd have problems buying a flat world, or a world made of flying islands - that's the kind of thing I expect out of a fantastical world. The Guilds have such interesting philosophies and basic concepts, and they're full of character.

And the races! I haven't even wrapped my head fully around what Ravnica has to offer, but I'm always fascinated by the melting pot aspect of a good high fantasy cityscape, and Ravnica is not disappointing me there. Seriously, give me playable stats for Ravnican Gorgons, and I will take back 99% of the bad things I have said about 5th edition - I've wanted gorgon PCs ever since Vraska came to the fore during the Ixalan storyline. I've heard the rumors of centaurs and minotaurs, and I'm hoping desperately that they're good. Viashino sound promising, because even if we have lizardfolk already, tail-whipping quick-strong lizards are a nice alternative to the primitive hulking tanks we already have. Besides, AD&D had something like a dozen different kinds of lizardfolk, 5e can stand to have 2. Dryads and faeries and merfolk would be wonderful, especially because I remember how much I enjoyed the hamadryads of 4e.

All in all... WotC are going to have to spectacularly mismanage this project to truly disappoint me on it. I welcome the prospect of future MtG "conversions", because the more D&D there is, the more official ingredients I can add to my kitchen as a homebrewing world-builder.

Also, I would cut a throat for a Kamigawa Planeshift. Give me decent 5e stats for ratfolk and kitsunes, and I will be a happy man - although the Soratami and Orochi are also really much desired, because they're just too awesome.