If you were able to design your own version of D&D, how would you do it?

Actually I'm just doing that with my ADOM RPG (see https://www.adom-rpg.com).

As for process: If I had the resources I'd be doing it like WotC.

As for the actual design:

• I love OSR, so that obviously would be my base - with the good ideas (especially advantage/disadvantage from 5e).
• I'm adding more classes (to fit my world) but wouldn't do subclasses for the sake of simplicity.
• ADOM RPG will have a simple skill system (somewhat reminiscient of proficiencies in AD&D 2e). Skills use advantage/disadvantage based checks and you can only every once in a while increase a skill by one level - no fiddly stuff like the point mess in 3e.
• No feats. I always disliked their fiddliness and the hundreds of feats you had to memorize. Combat specializations are handled via a few skills (like Mounted Combat, Berserkering, Two-Handed Combat and some more) and aligned with the rest of the skill system.
• Multi-classing more in line with 2e (but with experience penalties for multi-classed characters), dual-classing and (as an option) dual-classed multi-classing. For all races including humans.
• ADOM RPG won't have a Vancian spell system but will use power points to make magic a lot more flexible.
• I like the idea of Bounded Accuracy but IMHO 5e went too far. I like the OSR idea of not everything being in need of balancing but rather requiring players to always be careful and use their brains.
• Modern layout. Full color. Amazing art. Great typography. I just can't stand yet another game that looks like the 80s. Most of that stuff was really ugly. We can do better.

You can see current samples at https://www.adom-rpg.com/samples and the first three blog posts with design thoughts are up, too. More to come.

Piratecat said:

I know, right? I loved 3e (possibly inappropriately, if you know what I mean, and I think you do), and 5e is a joy. I'm seriously irked that I've really just run the game instead of played it. We just finished a 10 year campaign that had started in 4e.

That said, I had to dodge this question entirely when designing Swords of the Serpentine. It was definitely a process of "think of what you love about sword and sorcery heroes, and model that," instead of "recreate D&D with a different rules set" -- that latter would have been a disaster. So I asked myself "how can I hack TimeWatch or GUMSHOE in general into something that feels like epic fantasy?" Then I playtested the hell out of it - over 200 people over 2 years, which isn't so bad for basically one GM - and cut everything that didn't completely delight me.

Click to expand...

Pkitty!

Wait, Swords of the Serpentine is your baby? I've scrolled past the cover of it on Facebook a few times, but somehow that never clicked.

*reads a snippet about the game*

Whoa, Eversink! That storyhour was formative for me.

As a perennial game mechanic tinkerer, I'm curious what you came up with. My latest homebrew kitbash work is about trying to capture fighting game vibes in a tabletop game. Having a skill-based back and forth -- especially in a game where on player (the GM) is omnipotent -- is tough, and making it fast and breezy is even tougher.

RangerWickett said:

Pkitty!

Wait, Swords of the Serpentine is your baby?

Click to expand...

It is! And the best thing I've written, I think. I got to vastly expand and define Eversink, craft some super-fun rules (death curses! Social combat! True names! Freeform sorcery! Prophecy! Ridiculous luck!), and tie everything together. Playtest will hit early next week. I wanted to name it Eversink, but (a) like 3 other games start with "Ever-", and (b) apparently you don't put "Sink" in a title.

The fighting game is a fascinating challenge. You'd probably have to tie your damage and your move to your attack success roll to make it nice and fast, I dunno.

Piratecat! Long time, no see. I still owe you guys a coupla group pix of Abernathy's Company, don't I. I should really get on that...how many years has it been?

Anywho, to the question/thread at hand..."how would I do it?"...

Go to each edition/game system I like/enjoy and pull otu the best bits/parts I like the most and incorporate them all into one system. So...

1. Standard d20 system. Attacks, skill rolls, save rolls.

2. Standard 6 ability scores. 4d6, drop the lowest, arrange to taste. Ability core increases built into character advancement at periodic levels. Slight increase in base modifier/bonus & penalty numbers. Include Racial/species-ial maximums (and a few min's).

3. Formulaic non-human race/species bonus abilities to promote character balance across species.

4. Alignments that are effective, important, and have in-game/in-world consequences for PCs.

5. Class structures that are broken into category/groupings, each with its own HD, Prime Ability and ability score requirements, armor/weapon norms and proficiency advancements, skills and skill advancement, special/specific features, expertises, restrictions/limitations, etc...
--Mystics: d8s. Light & Medium armors & shields. Limited weapons. Prime Ability: Wisdom. Main Class thing: Channeling/Special [domain/deity related] powers.
Cleric (default), + Druid, + Templar (nee Paladin), + additional 'expert & advanced" options.
--Rogues: d10's. Light armors, no shields. Most weapons. Prime Ability: Dexterity. Main Class thing: Skill Expertise/Special [non magical] skills.
Thief (default), + Acrobat, + Ranger, + additional "advanced" options.
--Warriors: d12's. All armors, all shields. All weapons. Prime Ability: Strength. Main Class thing: Combat Expertise/Special [non-magical] maneuvers.
Fighter (default), + Knight, + Barbarian, + additional "expert & advanced" options.
--Wizards: d6's. No armor/no shields. Very limited weapons. Prime Ability: Intelligence. Main Class thing: Magic (spells/powers) use/Special [supernatural] abilities.
Mage (default), + Illusionist, + Psychic, + additional "expert & advanced" options.

6. Include as part of character creation and development "subclass/background/themes" akin to 5e backgrounds but with more in-game utility including, for some, combat uses. So a PC has a species, a class, and a theme [eventually multiple].

7. Broken up into "mini-games" with their own expectations for play, diversity, and complexity:
--"Beginner/low level (1-5)/Basic" game. Simplest version. Fewest options. Easiest (theoretically "smoothest/fastest") play.
--"Experienced/mid level (6-13)/Expert" game. Introduces more PC options (races, classes, subclass "themes"). Styles/locations for travel/adventure. Tougher monsters, more weapons, "bigger" magics, optional/additional features to incorporate or not (such as combat maneuvers, skill system to increase skill bonuses beyond "standard/basic" game modifiers, introduce strongholds & followers, etc...).
--"Master/high level (14-20+)/Advanced" game. Introduces more PC options. Inter-/Extra-planar travel/adventure. Tougher monsters, more weapons, "still and yet bigger" magics, more optional/additional features to incorporate or not (army/siege combat, kingdom/empire building, meta-magics & interchangeable spell level/slots, etc...)

(8. Introduce/expand player options with supplemental materials for further granular classes/subclasses, races/subraces, magic systems, rituals/spells, etc. etc. etc... As we all know, this is fantasy, it can go on forever. We wouldn't be trying to do that. Just flavorful and fun extra options...enough information and examples that people that want to "make up their own [race/class/skill/theme/whatever" are more than capable.)

Probably some more stuff...can't really recite my entire homebrewed system off the top of my head.

RangerWickett said:

My latest homebrew kitbash work is about trying to capture fighting game vibes in a tabletop game. Having a skill-based back and forth -- especially in a game where on player (the GM) is omnipotent -- is tough, and making it fast and breezy is even tougher.

Click to expand...

For me, nothing has ever come as close to a fighting game as Street Fighter: The Storytelling Game.

If you're taking the concept in a different direction, then I'd be curious to see your approach. It is probably beyond the purview of this thread, though.

Piratecat said:

The fighting game is a fascinating challenge. You'd probably have to tie your damage and your move to your attack success roll to make it nice and fast, I dunno.

Click to expand...

Cutting down on dice rolling is part of it, particularly since I want there to be a few more decision points in how you attack. So attacks would do flat damage, and you only roll d20s. (Sorry, other polyhedral dice. You slow things down.)

The two main mechanics were both inspired by the new Legend of the Five Rings card game by FFG, where

1. you can choose between five different 'Rings' when you attack, and if you win you get some bonus effect (Air steals their honor [aka life total], Earth steals their cards, Fire strengthens/weakens a creature, Water taps/untaps creatures, and Void sucks their fate [aka mana])
2. you can lose from running out of honor, OR you can lose by having your 'stronghold' broken. Each player has four provinces and one stronghold, each with their own quirks for how you defeat them. You have to 'break' three provinces (win an attack and deal some extra damage) before you can attack their stronghold, and if you break that, you win.

Provinces start off hidden, and are revealed when first attacked. One province (Shameful Display) might let you honor one of your characters and dishonor one of theirs (increasing/decreasing stats). Another (Endless Plains) might automatically break when attacked the first time, but force one of the attackers to be discarded (because he's lost in the wilderness).

So, in a tabletop format, as part of character creation each PC chooses a number of Aegises (2 at low level, more as you get stronger). An aegis is a one-use defense, which replenishes when you get a chance to rest out of combat. When someone attacks you, you can just take the hit, or you can break an aegis to downgrade the attack (critical hit > normal hit > miss > mishap).

Each aegis is better in some situations; like Nimble Footwork lets you downgrade and move your foe to another space adjacent to you. Most of the time that won't make a big deal, but sometimes it'll be amazing. Id Insinuation can downgrade any attack (you psychically predict their strike), but if you downgrade an attack against your Will, you get a free upgrade on your next attack against them on your next turn.

Monsters and NPCs have aegises too.

It's all very rough right now, but my desire is for the system to let you play "rocket tag" with attacks that have fun debilitory effects, but to give PCs the choice of when to use their defenses.

Aebir-Toril said:

10. The retention of the Warlock class, but with significant changes, making them a true thirdcaster with a greater variety of non-spell abilities.

Click to expand...

I'm not familiar with the term "thirdcaster". The only thing that pops to mind is the Eldritch Knight / Arcane Trickster with 1/3 casting advancement, but that doesn't seem to fit your context. Just looking to understand where you are going.

Blue said:

I'm not familiar with the term "thirdcaster". The only thing that pops to mind is the Eldritch Knight / Arcane Trickster with 1/3 casting advancement, but that doesn't seem to fit your context. Just looking to understand where you are going.

Click to expand...

Apologies.

That is what I meant by "thirdcaster". The reason it works with my concept is that the inclusion of extra features that function similarly to feats or invocations would remove some of the urgency of spell-casting capability. Furthermore, the incorporation of these features, which would work in conjunction with spells in a manner similar to how the Paladin can expend spell slots to power smites, would make the warlock a slightly-tougher, somewhat less versatile caster with a greater number of invocations. This type of warlock would have a limited spell list, and would use spell slots to power abilities about half of the time.

I’d keep things largely the same, but incorporate a few elements from other games/past editions in order to streamline te game a bit.

I’d go back to HP stop accumulating at a certain point. The high HP totals of PCs and monsters just makes fights go longer. I’d also like to incorporatesome kind of “vitality point” system in order to make certain attacks or spells especially deadly, and to keep even high level PCs cautious.

I’d also get rid of the XP system as it exists, and replace it with a streamlined one and keep the math flat. Give each class certain ways to earn XP based on all three pillars of the game, and then award 1 XP for each item. For example, a Rogue may have something like this:

- Use a skill to avoid confrontation or to bypass danger
- Inflict Sneak Attack damage
- Accumulate at least 100 GP worth of treasure

And so on. Probably also use Race and Background as well as Traits, Bonds, and Flaws as means of getting XP, too.

Those would be my main two areas of focus. Most of the rest of the game I’d leave alone.

I'd try to take the best bits of each edition to make an edition of D&D that is highly compatible with AD&D (the edition with my favorite adventures and campaign supplements) but without the baggage of AD&D (various subsystems for task resolution, THACO, level limits for demihumans, etc.).

In fact, that's what I've done:

AD&D 3rd Edition Player's Handbook

AD&D 3rd Edition Dungeon Master's Guide

The system can be used with AD&D adventures with a minimal amount of work, as the power level of PCs is more in line with that of older editions of D&D. To convert monsters, use the Monstrous Manual and the following guidelines:

To convert monsters:
1. Subtract the old armor class (AC) from 20 to get the new AC. AC 10 would remain AC 10, while an AC of -10 would become an AC of 30 in 3rd edition Advanced Dungeons & Dragons.
2. Multiply the old Movement Rate by 5 to get the new movement rate. A 12" movement rate would become a 60' movement rate in 3rd edition Advanced Dungeons & Dragons.
3. To quickly arrive at hit points multiply all hit dice by 5 in order to determine the monsters’ hit points. Round fractions up.
4. The attack bonus for all creatures equals the number of hit dice the creature possesses. For particularly strong creatures I'd add a +1 to +3 bonus to attack and damage rolls.
5. Handle special attacks suck as poison, level drain, and diseases as per the Dungeons Masters Guide, pages 70-72. The DC to resist monster's special attacks (i.e. poison, disease, charm, etc.) equal 10 + the creature's hit dice. This DC may be modified for special attacks that are particularly powerful or weak.
6. Spell-like abilities function at the listed caster level or, if that's not given, at a caster level equal to the creature's hit dice.
7. All Proficiency and Common Ability bonuses are based on HD