The Orville Season Two - Thoughts? - Page 37
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  1. #361
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    Quote Originally Posted by CapnZapp View Post
    I guess I'm about to give up on this show.

    Far too much preachy stuff with the crew on the obviously good side, with little complication or nuance. I guess unavoidable given your political climate in the US, but still. (In a show like Madam Secretary that so obviously is counter-programming to real politics I get it, but here...?)
    I don't agree with that. If there were no complication or nuance, the Moclans would have conceded that the women should be able to live on their planet in peace, and Bortus's child would have been allowed to remain female.

    The show is presenting these themes, but proceeding in very realistic ways. The Union professes beliefs in freedom and choice, but was pretty quick to throw those beliefs aside when their survival was at risk of Moclan left the Union. Bortus's daughter was given a strong fight, but the society that was very strong in their beliefs that no Moclan should remain female decided to give her a sex change anyway. If the political climate in the US(and elsewhere) mattered that much, those things would not have happened.

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    We have had flaws pop up pretty prominently in this series, though.

    Both Moclan regulars have had their foibles on parade more than once. We’ve had another character get really obsessive about a relationship with a simulated woman centuries dead.

    We had the Isaac reveal.

    Now, most of the flaws depicted were personal rather than professional, but the premise that the crew were a “B-team” from jump is a bit strained. The pilot has always been described as one of the best in the fleet...but he is a bit of a cocky showboater. The Captain is making a “comeback” because he fell apart in the past- his crisis is of no bearing on his actual level of competence.

    Etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxperson View Post
    I don't agree with that. If there were no complication or nuance, the Moclans would have conceded that the women should be able to live on their planet in peace, and Bortus's child would have been allowed to remain female.

    The show is presenting these themes, but proceeding in very realistic ways. The Union professes beliefs in freedom and choice, but was pretty quick to throw those beliefs aside when their survival was at risk of Moclan left the Union. Bortus's daughter was given a strong fight, but the society that was very strong in their beliefs that no Moclan should remain female decided to give her a sex change anyway. If the political climate in the US(and elsewhere) mattered that much, those things would not have happened.
    Sure. But my argument wasn't really that the show lacks any moral complexity.

    It is that the crew's own flaws have evaporated. Now Mercer is saving the Union in every other episode. It's as if the Union would self-implode if the Orville wasn't there each week to fix things.

    YAWN

  4. #364
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    Quote Originally Posted by CapnZapp View Post
    It is that the crew's own flaws have evaporated. Now Mercer is saving the Union in every other episode. It's as if the Union would self-implode if the Orville wasn't there each week to fix things.
    My God! You're right!! It's almost as if the Orville was the center of a show.

    They are going to be the center of whatever is happening, because that's how a show works. Do I wish he had those flaws he had in season 1? Sure. I liked those. Would that make much of a difference in the stories going on? Nope. He'd still be saving the Union every other episode, but with flaws.
    Laugh MNblockhead laughed with this post

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    I’m struggling to remember- what flaws did he have season 1 that have actually disappeared?

  6. #366
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dannyalcatraz View Post
    I’m struggling to remember- what flaws did he have season 1 that have actually disappeared?
    Mercer's self-doubt is gone, and they were a bit more bumbling in how they succeeded. They seem more competent this season than they were last season. The friction between Mercer and Grayson is gone, but they explained the cheating as not her fault, so that makes sense.

    Edit:LaMarr's mouth and Malloy's cockiness are also not getting them into as much trouble this season.
    Last edited by Maxperson; Wednesday, 17th April, 2019 at 02:11 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxperson View Post
    My God! You're right!! It's almost as if the Orville was the center of a show.

    They are going to be the center of whatever is happening, because that's how a show works. Do I wish he had those flaws he had in season 1? Sure. I liked those. Would that make much of a difference in the stories going on? Nope. He'd still be saving the Union every other episode, but with flaws.
    And, perhaps, accidentally.
    XP Maxperson gave XP for this post

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    But you’d expect a former command officer on his second go round to not only have a bit of confidence to be able to do his job before, but also have it returning because he’s been on a bit of a roll.

    At this point, his self-doubt was mostly personal, it seemed to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dannyalcatraz View Post
    But you’d expect a former command officer on his second go round to not only have a bit of confidence to be able to do his job before, but also have it returning because he’s been on a bit of a roll.

    At this point, his self-doubt was mostly personal, it seemed to me.
    As I recall the beginning of season 1 there was a surfeit of ships and a dearth of qualified command officers. On his ex-wife's recommendation Mercer, who was still lacking in confidence, was given command of Orville. In season 2 he is more confident.

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    Right, but he had to have confidence & competence to reach command rank in the first place- IOW, the backstory to the current story chronology. He then suffered his crisis, costing him his command and confidence.

    Season 1, he was still shaky. Season 2, though, he’s been on a roll, so the pre-crisis Captain Mercer has begun to resurface.

    But having spectacularly gone to pieces once means he could still do so again. He has been prickly about the Krill “Mata Hari”, of course. Perhaps that wound will fester.

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