Star Trek Discovery not getting any better I fear.

Jester David · Apr 20, 2019

Still haven’t gotten back in. But heard about the finale.
So... the Discovery is 900 years in the future?

Do you think they’ll get background their “present”?
Or do you think it’s an excuse to move the series to an undetailed era so they no longer need to worry about canon?

Hussar · Apr 20, 2019

My guess is that they'll stay in the future. That way they can do new stuff, not have to worry about gaggles of complaining "fans" who want to do nothing but pick holes in things, and can actually move forward. New stuff to explore and all that.

Destroying Leland did not destroy Control [MENTION=2518]Derren[/MENTION]. Control was destroyed by Star Fleet HQ at the end of the show. All they destroyed was a local instance that was controlling (heh) the fleet. Can't pilot all those ships remotely with all the subspace relays down now can they?

And, I'm sorry, but that fight scene was AWESOME.

Sure, the bulkhead thing was lame, but, let's not forget, they did actually tell you that with the bulkheads closed, they'd still lose a big old chunk of the ship - which they did. With the bulkhead open, the whole ship would be lost. Does make you wonder what they make the bulkheads out of.

And, as far as the shuttles go, I would assume that they did have the shuttles - they did just fight a major war against the Klingons. Every Star Fleet ship would still be geared up for that. Which means lots of shuttles. That's not even breaking canon if you're a Star Fleet Battles fan. As far as using it against the Klingons, how often did we actually see a battle with the Klingons after the first episode. A couple of engagements, but, nothing serious. And, again, they did say that they were converting all shuttles and pods to make fighters. Nice to see them actually use the technological capabilities of the ships for once instead of ignoring it.

The question you should be asking is, if Enterprise D or any later ship had replicators to the extent that they do, why didn't they ever do this tactic before? Makes pretty much zero sense that they didn't. DS9 had an entire station at its disposal and never bothered making so much as a skiff. The Runabout's were delivered from Star Fleet. Why didn't they just fabricate a couple of thousand of those to deal with the Dominion.

Oh, right, we're supposed to talk about Discovery plot holes... all the other enormous plot holes in other Trek's we're supposed to ignore because Discovery sucks and all the other Trek's were examples of perfection. :uhoh:

Zardnaar · Apr 20, 2019

Hussar said:
My guess is that they'll stay in the future. That way they can do new stuff, not have to worry about gaggles of complaining "fans" who want to do nothing but pick holes in things, and can actually move forward. New stuff to explore and all that.

Destroying Leland did not destroy Control [MENTION=2518]Derren[/MENTION]. Control was destroyed by Star Fleet HQ at the end of the show. All they destroyed was a local instance that was controlling (heh) the fleet. Can't pilot all those ships remotely with all the subspace relays down now can they?

And, I'm sorry, but that fight scene was AWESOME.

Sure, the bulkhead thing was lame, but, let's not forget, they did actually tell you that with the bulkheads closed, they'd still lose a big old chunk of the ship - which they did. With the bulkhead open, the whole ship would be lost. Does make you wonder what they make the bulkheads out of.

And, as far as the shuttles go, I would assume that they did have the shuttles - they did just fight a major war against the Klingons. Every Star Fleet ship would still be geared up for that. Which means lots of shuttles. That's not even breaking canon if you're a Star Fleet Battles fan. As far as using it against the Klingons, how often did we actually see a battle with the Klingons after the first episode. A couple of engagements, but, nothing serious. And, again, they did say that they were converting all shuttles and pods to make fighters. Nice to see them actually use the technological capabilities of the ships for once instead of ignoring it.

The question you should be asking is, if Enterprise D or any later ship had replicators to the extent that they do, why didn't they ever do this tactic before? Makes pretty much zero sense that they didn't. DS9 had an entire station at its disposal and never bothered making so much as a skiff. The Runabout's were delivered from Star Fleet. Why didn't they just fabricate a couple of thousand of those to deal with the Dominion.

Oh, right, we're supposed to talk about Discovery plot holes... all the other enormous plot holes in other Trek's we're supposed to ignore because Discovery sucks and all the other Trek's were examples of perfection.

DS9 ( had self replicating cloaked mines in it they manufactured. DS9 also had an awesome cast with interesting characters, up to series 7 now final 10 episodes or so. It was never hinted that they had replicators big enough to replicate starships in DS9. That is a new add on that the writers of STD thought was a great idea but didn't think through. That is on them not the DS9 writers.

Jester David · Apr 20, 2019

Catching up. Just watched Red Angel.

Some good moments. Nice scenes. Spock had some great lines.

But HOLY EFF were there some plot holes.
The big one was the idea that they needed to keep Burnham filled in so they could trap her future self. Ummm. No. It's the opposite. It's her from the future. They can't trap her if she remembers it's a trap. They should have assumed they needed to keep her out of the loop. Heck, they didn't even need to really killer her: just trick her into believing she's about to die.

Also... time crystals?!? What the eff.
Overlooking that Starfleet had Time Suits apparently as early as 2220, that makes you wonder why Picard couldn't travel through time a little easier.
But time crystals? That's the laziest name they could have come up with for the MacGuffin power sourced.
They might as well have named it "magic pixie dust" for all the thought they put into rationalizing it and explaining how it works.

Jester David · Apr 20, 2019

Hussar said:
My guess is that they'll stay in the future. That way they can do new stuff, not have to worry about gaggles of complaining "fans" who want to do nothing but pick holes in things, and can actually move forward. New stuff to explore and all that.

The quotation marks around "fans" and implying that we're not fans because we like continuity is an unnecessarily provocative statement. That's just a gauntlet throw down.
Why not just insult my mother while you're at it?

Zardnaar · Apr 20, 2019

Your mother smells like elderberries. I can't remember the quote lol.

Sadras · Apr 20, 2019

I think I figured it out, the writers were too "story now" focused with "fail forward" challenges, they hadn't done enough prep hence the plot holes and continuity issues.

Derren · Apr 20, 2019

Sadras said:
I think I figured it out, the writers were too "story now" focused with "fail forward" challenges, they hadn't done enough prep hence the plot holes and continuity issues.

Not enough prep is certainly true.
Noticed how the ending with Burnham creating the signals one after anoter, the last one several months after the rest, doesn't fit the initial premise of 7 signals appearing at the same time?

Nagol · Apr 20, 2019

Jester David said:
Still haven’t gotten back in. But heard about the finale.
So... the Discovery is 900 years in the future?

Do you think they’ll get background their “present”?
Or do you think it’s an excuse to move the series to an undetailed era so they no longer need to worry about canon?

Probably. After watching the finale, I got my hopes up it was the series finale, but alas, it is only the season's. I expect next season (and probably any after that) will remain in the future so as to not constrain the writers.

Nagol · Apr 20, 2019

Sadras said:
I think I figured it out, the writers were too "story now" focused with "fail forward" challenges, they hadn't done enough prep hence the plot holes and continuity issues.

Nah, the writers simply had an story that felt interesting and fun to them. It's just a pity that it wouldn't fit within the constraints of the universe, so they ignored the constraints that they felt interfered with the precious story and/or the cinematic awesomeness.