Do you want Greyhawk updated to 5e?

S'mon · Feb 28, 2019

Paul Farquhar said:
White Plume Mountain, that Tales from the Yawning Portal unapologetically translates to the Forgotten Realms and Krynn

? I didn't notice any translating?

...Oh there is a tiny box on pg 95 which says it's set in Greyhawk, but you could place it near Mt Hotenow near Neverwinter. The actual adventure seems 100% the same.

Hussar · Feb 28, 2019

I wonder if the main difference between Greyhawk and FR isn't really one of substance but rather presentation. GH was presented, mainly, through modules. Almost everything we know about GH was part of some early days module which, at the time, had very little plot, and what plot there was was usually some variation of "go here and kill everything and take its treasure".

OTOH, FR was almost never presented through modules. There are very few FR modules and nearly everything we know about FR was presented in some sort of campaign guide.

FR was presented as something to read about. GH was presented as something to be played. I wonder if that hasn't led to such a perceptual difference between the settings.

Leatherhead · Feb 28, 2019

Greyhawk isn't in my top 5 list of settings for sure.
It's probably not even in my top 10 list if we include subsettings.

oreofox · Feb 28, 2019

Hussar said:
I wonder if the main difference between Greyhawk and FR isn't really one of substance but rather presentation. GH was presented, mainly, through modules. Almost everything we know about GH was part of some early days module which, at the time, had very little plot, and what plot there was was usually some variation of "go here and kill everything and take its treasure".

OTOH, FR was almost never presented through modules. There are very few FR modules and nearly everything we know about FR was presented in some sort of campaign guide.

FR was presented as something to read about. GH was presented as something to be played. I wonder if that hasn't led to such a perceptual difference between the settings.

FR was mostly presented through novels and video games, with a number of campaign guides tossed in there as well. I know that's how I was introduced to FR.

Demetrios1453 · Feb 28, 2019

oreofox said:
FR was mostly presented through novels and video games, with a number of campaign guides tossed in there as well. I know that's how I was introduced to FR.

The campaign guides, whether for the world as a whole or just parts of the setting, weren't just a number "tossed in there". There were dozens of guides in 2e alone, and dozens more in 3e. I'm not going to sit here and count them up, but they have to number somewhere around 50 - 100 different setting books for 2e and 3e together in total for the Forgotten Realms. That's far above the number of video games; where the number of novels compare to that - again, it's a lot, but I don't have the exact number...

TheSword · Feb 28, 2019

There were some pretty amazing products... Ruins of Myth Drannor is one of my favourite products of all time. As was the Menzzoberranzan boxed set.

Hussar · Feb 28, 2019

oreofox said:
FR was mostly presented through novels and video games, with a number of campaign guides tossed in there as well. I know that's how I was introduced to FR.

That's my point.

FR was very much a child of gaming in the 80's and 90's where material was stuff to be read, rather than stuff to be used. TSR was very much a fiction book publisher almost more than game creator. There are literally thousands (if you include novels - tens of thousands) of pages of material for FR. And, out of those thousands of pages, we've got what, a dozen or so modules? None of which are considered very good.

Contrast to Greyhawk where we have a few hundred pages of setting material and dozens and dozens of modules, many of which are iconic to D&D. Even with the resurgence of Paizohawk in the pages of Dungeon in the 3e era, we got three Adventure Paths all set in Greyhawk. Mostly thanks to [MENTION=2174]Erik Mona[/MENTION] who is a HUUUUGE Greyhawk fan.

But, that's my point. Greyhawk has always been presented as a setting to be used, rather than a setting to read about. Honestly, I think that has contributed so much to its endurance. How many old gamers like me have pulled out their battered, worn copy of some 1e Greyhawk module to use in a pinch over the years? Many I'd wager. Those modules are iconic for a reason. I've used Orlane so many times I could run the module out of my head.

Think of the most iconic locations in Greyhawk - Hommlet, Orlane, The Grand Duchy of Geoff, all the places that resonate with gamers. All locations indelibly tied to a particular set of adventures. Now, think of iconic locations in Forgotten Realms - Waterdeep, Cormyr, the Dale Lands. How many modules are tied to those locations? What adventures do you associate with them? Homebrew stuff? Sure. Tons of it. Lots of people run games in FR.

But shared experiences? Until 5e, there were precious few.

MoonSong · Mar 1, 2019

Ok among:

World of Greyhawk (1980)
World of Greyhawk (1983)
Greyhawk Castle
Greyhawk Wars
From the Ashes
Greyhawk Return of the Eight
Greyhawk Players Guide
Greyhawk The Adventure Begins
Greyhawk city
Iuz the Evil
Vecna Lives
Die Vecna Die!
D&D Gazetteer
Living Greyhawk Gazetteer
Expedition to Greyhawk Castle

Which ones are good and which ones aren't worth it? Which ones overlap?

Demetrios1453 · Mar 1, 2019

MoonSong said:
Ok among:

World of Greyhawk (1980)

World of Greyhawk (1983)

Greyhawk Castle

Greyhawk Wars

From the Ashes

Greyhawk Return of the Eight

Greyhawk Players Guide

Greyhawk The Adventure Begins

Greyhawk city

Iuz the Evil

Vecna Lives

Die Vecna Die!

D&D Gazetteer

Living Greyhawk Gazetteer

Expedition to Greyhawk Castle

Which ones are good and which ones aren't worth it? Which ones overlap?

I know some who would champion the older material might get a bit upset at this, but I think the Living Greyhawk Gazatteer is an excellent overview of the setting. It's very much a "just the facts" accessory, with little in the way of game-type info (mainly just quick-reference abbreviations like "LG Pal15" and the like after names), but heavy on the geography, population, religions, and history of the various locations in the setting. It also has the distinction of being the most up-to-date overview of the setting available. The only real let-down is the sometimes abysmal line-drawing art.

The D&D Gazetteer is just an extremely cut-down version of this, so no reason to really look at getting it.

(On a total off-tangent, while digging through my boxes of D&D books to find my copy of the LGG - which is odd in itself, as I usually keep it in more accessible areas - I discovered my thought-to-be long-lost copy of the Spelljammer accessory Realmspace. Score!)

Maxperson · Mar 1, 2019

No. I don't want to see Greyhawk detailed for 5e. They are not going to do many campaigns and we already have a generic setting in the Forgotten Realms. I'd much rather see something like Planescape, Al Qadim, or Ravenloft.

I wouldn't mind seeing 6e use a detailed Greyhawk instead of the Realms, though.