EN5ider #267: Weapon Degradation

ParanoydStyle · Apr 16, 2019

I feel like degrading equipment sort of goes against the grain of 5E's design philosophy in general, which has been to create a game with no drawbacks for characters, only advantages. This is most immediately relevant in races, all of which conspicuously lost their ability score penalties but is evident in several other areas of the game. This feels consistent with the changes made in streamlining recent iterations of the Elder Scroll series of video-games, where between Oblivion and Skyrim the choice was made that instead of the game having the mechanic of needing to repair your weapon versus wear and tear, it would have a mechanic where you could improve your weapons by tempering them, which seems much more "5E" to me.

Now, I am sure there are people playing 5E who would like a weapon degradation system without switching games, so yay for this article. But the idea seems better suited to almost any fantasy game but 5E.

(Psi)SeveredHead · Apr 17, 2019

I have uncharitable feelings about the idea. Is it realistic? Probably. But I don't want it.

I don't like guns in my D&D because all of a sudden I have to deal with a lot of realistic rules. Guns don't fire when it's wet (if I say it's a dark and stormy night, instead of adding background I'm nerfing a PC!). Furthermore bows shouldn't be strung all the time or be used in a rainstorm, but I've literally never seen one GM enforce that "rule". This would be worse, because now that kind of thing happens to every weapon.

The only way I could accept such a rule is in a game with more narrative rules. In Dungeon World, that could be a consequence of a middling skill roll (you succeed but you lose something something, so maybe you hit your opponent in the belly, but your weapon splintered). In Fate, you get a Fate Point. In Mutants & Masterminds, you get a hero point. And so forth. The only similar tool I'm aware of for 5e is "inspiration". I don't think breaking my sword would make me feel inspired.

The Crimson Binome · Apr 17, 2019

I remember a game where armor had its own HP pool; and when you took damage, it gave you the choice of splitting it between your own HP and the armor's HP, or just taking it all to your own HP.

Invariably, players would take all of the damage to their own HP; because those HP regenerated automatically with time, where the armor's HP had to be repaired with cash.

Greenstone.Walker · Apr 17, 2019

Armour and weapon breaking makes the "linear fighter quadratic wizard" issue worse. It also makes Dexterity more of a "god stat" (why would I play a Strength-based fighter whose armor and greatsword keeps breaking instead of a Dexterity based one who only needs enough Strength to carry five rapiers?).

Mike Myler · Apr 22, 2019

ParanoydStyle said:
I feel like degrading equipment sort of goes against the grain of 5E's design philosophy in general, which has been to create a game with no drawbacks for characters, only advantages. This is most immediately relevant in races, all of which conspicuously lost their ability score penalties but is evident in several other areas of the game. This feels consistent with the changes made in streamlining recent iterations of the Elder Scroll series of video-games, where between Oblivion and Skyrim the choice was made that instead of the game having the mechanic of needing to repair your weapon versus wear and tear, it would have a mechanic where you could improve your weapons by tempering them, which seems much more "5E" to me.

Now, I am sure there are people playing 5E who would like a weapon degradation system without switching games, so yay for this article. But the idea seems better suited to almost any fantasy game but 5E.

(Psi)SeveredHead said:
I have uncharitable feelings about the idea. Is it realistic? Probably. But I don't want it.

I don't like guns in my D&D because all of a sudden I have to deal with a lot of realistic rules. Guns don't fire when it's wet (if I say it's a dark and stormy night, instead of adding background I'm nerfing a PC!). Furthermore bows shouldn't be strung all the time or be used in a rainstorm, but I've literally never seen one GM enforce that "rule". This would be worse, because now that kind of thing happens to every weapon.

The only way I could accept such a rule is in a game with more narrative rules. In Dungeon World, that could be a consequence of a middling skill roll (you succeed but you lose something something, so maybe you hit your opponent in the belly, but your weapon splintered). In Fate, you get a Fate Point. In Mutants & Masterminds, you get a hero point. And so forth. The only similar tool I'm aware of for 5e is "inspiration". I don't think breaking my sword would make me feel inspired.

Saelorn said:
I remember a game where armor had its own HP pool; and when you took damage, it gave you the choice of splitting it between your own HP and the armor's HP, or just taking it all to your own HP.

Invariably, players would take all of the damage to their own HP; because those HP regenerated automatically with time, where the armor's HP had to be repaired with cash.

Greenstone.Walker said:
Armour and weapon breaking makes the "linear fighter quadratic wizard" issue worse. It also makes Dexterity more of a "god stat" (why would I play a Strength-based fighter whose armor and greatsword keeps breaking instead of a Dexterity based one who only needs enough Strength to carry five rapiers?).

Erik's a bit of an OSR-style designer and I had many of the same misgivings you're all voicing here--which is what the second half of the article is about, offering up rules for when you choose to break your weapon to get something extra out of it (the blade sticks in your target, etc. etc. etc. there's like 6 different things per weapon damage type).