Help Balance Features for Alternate Dragonborn, Please

Dragonborn are neat and everything, but they really only over ancestries of the chromatic and metallic dragons. So, I decided to make some alternate features for dragonborn with ancestries from the lung dragons (that first appeared in the Fiend Folio and Oriental Adventures).

Please help me balance these new features with the existing breath weapon feature of the PHB dragonborn, and polish up the language. Here are my first drafts:

Rolling Wave (Chiang Lung Ancestry). You can use your action to create a wave of water that bursts down a 5 by 30 ft. line. Each creature in that area must make a Dexterity saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, a creature takes 2d6 bludgeoning damage and is knocked prone. On a successful save, a creature takes half as much damage and isn’t knocked prone. The damage increases to 3d6 at 6th level, 4d6 at 11th level, and 5d6 at 16th level.

After you use your rolling wave feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

Tremors (Li Lung Ancestry). You can use your action to unleash a series of tremors radiating in a 15 ft. cone on the ground before you. Each creature in that area must make a Dexterity saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, a creature takes 2d6 bludgeoning damage and is knocked prone. On a successful save, a creature takes half as much damage and isn’t knocked prone. The damage increases to 3d6 at 6th level, 4d6 at 11th level, and 5d6 at 16th level.

After you use your tremors feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

Typhoon (Tun Mi Lung Ancestry). You can use your action to surround yourself with hurricane-like winds. Any creature within 10 feet of you must make a Strength saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, the creature takes 1d6 bludgeoning damage and is pushed 10 feet away from you. On a successful save, the creature takes half as much damage and isn’t pushed. The damage increases to 2d6 at 6th level, 3d6 at 11th level, and 4d6 at 16th level.

After you use your typhoon feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

Water Fire (Pan Lung & Shen Lung Ancestries). You can use your action to surround yourself with a ghostly burning liquid. Any creature within 10 feet of you must make a Constitution saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. A creature takes 2d6 radiant damage on a failed save, and half as much damage on a successful one. The damage increases to 3d6 at 6th level, 4d6 at 11th level, and 5d6 at 16th level.

After you use your water fire feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

Azzy said:

Rolling Wave (Chiang Lung Ancestry). You can use your action to create a wave of water that bursts down a 5 by 30 ft. line. Each creature in that area must make a Dexterity saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, a creature takes 2d6 bludgeoning damage and is knocked prone. On a successful save, a creature takes half as much damage and isn’t knocked prone. The damage increases to 3d6 at 6th level, 4d6 at 11th level, and 5d6 at 16th level.

After you use your rolling wave feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

Tremors (Li Lung Ancestry). You can use your action to unleash a series of tremors radiating in a 15 ft. cone on the ground before you. Each creature in that area must make a Dexterity saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, a creature takes 2d6 bludgeoning damage and is knocked prone. On a successful save, a creature takes half as much damage and isn’t knocked prone. The damage increases to 3d6 at 6th level, 4d6 at 11th level, and 5d6 at 16th level.

After you use your tremors feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

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These are strictly better than any existing one, since they have full damage plus inflicting a condition, prone. The only possible downside is bludgeoning damage which actually has a lot less creatures in the MM with immunities and resistances then some of the elemental types.

Note that unlike a lot of other powers, the proning also doesn't have a max size. So you can knock down titans with it. (Multiple titans, as long as they are in a row or cone. )

Since we're looking at multiple chances to prone (all the foes int he AoE), plus even a single success means attacks with Advantage from melee-based allies, I'd want to tone these down some.

Azzy said:

Typhoon (Tun Mi Lung Ancestry). You can use your action to surround yourself with hurricane-like winds. Any creature within 10 feet of you must make a Strength saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, the creature takes 1d6 bludgeoning damage and is pushed 10 feet away from you. On a successful save, the creature takes half as much damage and isn’t pushed. The damage increases to 2d6 at 6th level, 3d6 at 11th level, and 4d6 at 16th level.

After you use your typhoon feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

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Moving to a weak save, but reducing damage one die and adding knockback. A larger AoE in terms of area covered, but offset by having to be surrounded. Works well for when you want to escape due to knockback disengaging enemies. Should be okay. Same note that there is no size noted so you can push back gargantuan creatures.

Is fine as is, slight preference for changing damage to standard number but d4s instead of reducing number of dice by one. Keeps damage a bit more relevant at low levels, and scales instead of always being 3.5 HPs behind (on average) since the knockback will remain useful. But it's really a nitpicking small amount.

Azzy said:

Water Fire (Pan Lung & Shen Lung Ancestries). You can use your action to surround yourself with a ghostly burning liquid. Any creature within 10 feet of you must make a Constitution saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. A creature takes 2d6 radiant damage on a failed save, and half as much damage on a successful one. The damage increases to 3d6 at 6th level, 4d6 at 11th level, and 5d6 at 16th level.

After you use your water fire feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

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Comments on the area above. Radiant has less immunities/resistances and more vulnerabilities, but considering how all-over-the-map the PHB breath weapon damage types are that doesn't look like the designers consider that a big deal. (I'm looking at you poison. And you fire aren't far behind.) So should be fine.

Damage from non-element things such as fire and cold should do half of what something that deals fire or cold should do. Mostly since it cannot be protected against or resisted. Same thing with radiant damage since most things have no protections from this. These would be great for a band of strange NPCs the PCs fight. Then they can break the 'normal' rules of balance.

Thank you guys, I really appreciate the feedback.

Okay, I've altered them a bit:


Amphibious (Chiang Lung, Lung Wang, Pan Lung, & Tun Mi Lung Ancestries). You can breathe air and water.

Breath Weapon (Lung Wang & T’ien Lung Ancestries). You can use your action to exhale destructive energy. Lung wang dragonborn exhale a breath of steam while pan lung dragonborn belch forth flame. Both deal fire damage in a 15 ft. cone

When you use your breath weapon, each creature in the area of the exhalation must make a Dexterity saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. A creature takes 2d6 damage on a failed save, and half as much damage on a successful one. The damage increases to 3d6 at 6th level, 4d6 at 11th level, and 5d6 at 16th level.

After you use your breath weapon, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

Rolling Wave (Chiang Lung Ancestry). You can use your action to create a wave of water that bursts down a 5 by 30 ft. line. Each creature in that area must make a Dexterity saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, a creature takes 2d4 bludgeoning damage and is knocked prone. On a successful save, a creature takes half as much damage and isn’t knocked prone. The damage increases to 3d4 at 6th level, 4d4 at 11th level, and 5d4 at 16th level.

After you use your rolling wave feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

Tremors (Li Lung Ancestry). You can use your action to unleash a series of tremors radiating in a 15 ft. cone on the ground before you. Each creature in that area must make a Dexterity saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, a creature takes 2d4 bludgeoning damage and is knocked prone. On a successful save, a creature takes half as much damage and isn’t knocked prone. The damage increases to 3d4 at 6th level, 4d4 at 11th level, and 5d4 at 16th level.

After you use your tremors feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

Typhoon (Tun Mi Lung Ancestry). You can use your action to surround yourself with hurricane-like winds. Any creature within 10 feet of you must make a Strength saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, the creature takes 2d4 bludgeoning damage and is pushed 10 feet away from you. On a successful save, the creature takes half as much damage and isn’t pushed. The damage increases to 3d4 at 6th level, 4d4 at 11th level, and 5d4 at 16th level.

After you use your typhoon feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

Swim (Chiang Lung, Lung Wang, Pan Lung, & Tun Mi Lung Ancestries). You have a swimming speed of 30 feet.

Water Fire (Pan Lung & Shen Lung Ancestries). You can use your action to surround yourself with a ghostly burning liquid. Any creature within 10 feet of you must make a Constitution saving throw. The DC for this saving throw equals 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus. A creature takes 2d6 radiant damage on a failed save, and half as much damage on a successful one. The damage increases to 3d6 at 6th level, 4d6 at 11th level, and 5d6 at 16th level.

After you use your water fire feature, you can’t use it again until you complete a short or long rest.

DRAGON TRAIT
Chiang lung (river dragon) Amphibious, swim, rolling wave
Li lung (earth dragon) Earthquake
Lung wang (sea dragon) Amphibious, swim, breath weapon
Pan lung (coiled dragon) Amphibious, swim, water fire
Shen lung (spirit dragon) Damage resistance (lightning), water fire
T’ien lung (celestial dragon) Damage resistance (fire), breath weapon
Tun mi lung (typhoon dragon) Amphibious, swim, typhoon

Reducing damage is ok, but I would not say they were unbalanced before.
The wording implied for both bludgeoning type attacks, that they can only used on the ground, which most creatures are, but not all.
I also would not rate bludgeoning damage higher than elemental damage. The barbarian for example resists all bludgeoning damage, heavy armor masters also resist some of it. There are tons of monsters that resist bludgeoning damage from nonmagical attacks, which this is.

UngeheuerLich said:

Reducing damage is ok, but I would not say they were unbalanced before.
The wording implied for both bludgeoning type attacks, that they can only used on the ground, which most creatures are, but not all.
I also would not rate bludgeoning damage higher than elemental damage. The barbarian for example resists all bludgeoning damage, heavy armor masters also resist some of it. There are tons of monsters that resist bludgeoning damage from nonmagical attacks, which this is.

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I remember someone going through the monster manual (probably with the help of D&DBeyond) analyzing the usefulness of the different damage types. If In remember right, bludgeoning, slashing and piercing were all near the top of the scale, although from top to bottom everything was roughly equal, or equal enough to not matter . . . except for the very bottom of the scale.

Poison sucks.

Follow-up: the search function works well

http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?634800-Damage-types-How-much-is-a-point-of-x-damage-worth

Satyrn said:

I remember someone going through the monster manual (probably with the help of D&DBeyond) analyzing the usefulness of the different damage types. If In remember right, bludgeoning, slashing and piercing were all near the top of the scale, although from top to bottom everything was roughly equal, or equal enough to not matter . . . except for the very bottom of the scale.

Poison sucks.

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Yes, poison sucks due to undead... but it is still useful enough.
The problem with that analysis was that it didn´t weight enemies by number of appearances in a typical campaign.
So it was interesting but not too useful. I don´t know about your typical campaigns, but in my campaigns, many enemies are humanoids without a lot of resistances. Yes, undead are als appearing often enough, but against undead you often have other big guns.

For the oriental dragons, I think I would look at the aasimar's aura abilities and change the effects to be more in tune with your earth, wind, water, and fire gimmick. I recall that some of the OD's had breath weapons, but the water fire and commanding aquatic critters stood out more for me than the breath weapon.