Paizo To Make Kingmaker Bestiary... For D&D 5E!

Jester David · May 6, 2019

billd91 said:
That assumes they were actually reprinted - but Paizo generally doesn't reprint their APs. They may have been out of stock by then, though. Does anybody know for sure whether Kingmaker actually got reprinted?

By "reprint" I mean "hardcover collection & revision". No AP was simply reprinted.

Jester David · May 6, 2019

kenmarable said:
Well, obviously it's going to peak sometime, there's only so many human beings. But "geek aligned" is now mainstream pop culture. A movie about freaking *Thanos and the Infinity Stones* of all things just made $2 billion in a couple weeks.

Also, if we are discussing anecdotal evidence, the past 6 months I have seen more new players than in the 6 months before that which was more than the 6 months before that, and so on. I expect the next 6 months to have more new players than the past 6 months. Sure, there were a ridiculous number of new players in 2017 and 2018, but from what I have seen, new player acquisition is still accelerating, not peaking or slowing down at all. So there may very well be an even ridculouser number of new players in 2019, and possibly even 2020.

So *my* gut feeling is that 5e has quite a ways to go before it peaks.

But either way, it's just our gut feelings and anecdotal evidence pointing in opposite directions. Neither of which is any actual evidence of the reality of the situation.

Sure. But after two seasons of Stranger Things and the appearances on Big Bang Theory plus the phenomena that is Critical Role over the last two years... where are all these nerds that want to play D&D but haven't started yet?

I'd hesitate to call this a "guess" even. Because it does feel like just a vague prediction. I wouldn't even bet a single cent that I was right. (Well... a few cents maybe. Nothing more than a dime. Maybe a buck.)
I just think we're at or near "peak D&D" and should expect it to flatten in growth.

Also... do we really want it to get much bigger? It already feels like the D&D team is losing some of the approachability they've had the last few years. And the big conventions like GenCon are becoming harder to gain access to.

robus · May 6, 2019

Jester David said:
Sure. But after two seasons of Stranger Things and the appearances on Big Bang Theory plus the phenomena that is Critical Role over the last two years... where are all these nerds that want to play D&D but haven't started yet?

Despite claims to the contrary, if you're not inside the D&D world but are curious it's actually quite hard to find a group of people to play with. So there could be a large number of people still lurking, waiting for a game to arise. And, no, the FLGS is not an appealing resource to many people.

kenmarable · May 6, 2019

Jester David said:
...where are all these nerds that want to play D&D but haven't started yet?

That's one of the issues right there. You keep wondering where are all the geeks and nerds who aren't playing, but the reality is that it's not just geeks & nerds who are playing anymore (or, more likely, there are so many nerds now that the definition is approaching meaningless). D&D is not just for nerds.

MechaTarrasque · May 6, 2019

If 5e is starting to slow down, they certainly timed it right, being 2 years out from the movie (and possibly 6e). By the time "5e is in trouble" becomes accepted, it will be drowned out by other things.

ShinHakkaider · May 6, 2019

Jester David said:
Gonna nitpick here. The first volumes of the AP went out of print in 2013. I snatched up one of the last few copies of the AP back then. It and Skull & Shackles were the APs that went OOP surprisingly fast, and have been high on the fan speculation as being future reprints since.
But the later volumes (which always sell more slowly) might have just recently sold out...

I stand corrected. Paizo usually lists sales for thier product that they are running out of and during the most recent of those (which was sometime last year I think) I noticed copies of the Kingmaker AP on that sale list. Those probably WERE some of the later volumes as opposed to the earlier ones.

Wrathamon · May 6, 2019

Maybe Critical Role got the bump because 5e was so successful and they were able to attract a big audience because of D&D being back.

In return, their success helps extend its dominance.

S'mon · May 6, 2019

Jester David said:
Sure. But after two seasons of Stranger Things and the appearances on Big Bang Theory plus the phenomena that is Critical Role over the last two years... where are all these

From what I see on the D&D UK Facebook group there's still a TON of people who want to play but have no group and not much idea how to get started. The rate of newbie arrival seems to be
increasing if anything. It's almost like the early-80s fad except it's 16-20 year olds not 10-14
year olds, and 50% female not 90% male.

Mistwell · May 6, 2019

We can debate if Critical Role was a major reason for 5e's success, but I think it's pretty absurd to argue Stranger Things caused the popularity of 5e. The first D&D episode of Stranger Things was too far into 5e's existing success to credit Stranger Things with the success.

Parmandur · May 6, 2019

ShinHakkaider said:
The thing is, while I disagree with that d00d on more than a few things? I dont think that he's entirely WRONG about this part.

5E WAS popular within the TTRPG community in those two years. As an alternative to both 4E and the crunchier games like Pathfinder. People who abandoned D&D during 4E returned to play this easier, simpler game.

But OUTSIDE of the TTRPG community is where STRANGER THINGS and CRITICAL ROLE were most influential and drew in people who were unaware that TTRPG's were still a thing. Even better, with CRITICAL ROLE they were able to actually SEE what a TTRPG WAS or HOW IT COULD BE. It's one thing to explain to a person who is completely unfamiliar with RPG's how the game is played. But when they are able to go on youtube and watch an episode and have it click with them and then maybe even have them go "Well I want to play or run a game like THAT." That is what I think boosted the popularity of D&D 5E into the stratisphere.

I knew that 5E was popular when around a year or two ago I was in Midtown Comics in Times Square and overheard not one but TWO different groups of people talking about their D&D groups in relation to CRITICAL ROLE.

Hell the only reason I have the 5E core books is because of CRITICAL ROLE. I'm a pretty dedicated Pathfinder GM but I had to pickup the books becasue I wanted to know the rules. .

That's not accurate: before Stranger Things happened, or Critical Role became big, 5E had already outsold 3E, 3.5 and 4E COMBINED. And then the growth accelerated, sure.