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Thread: Firearms

  1. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Kobold Avenger View Post
    My goal with Firearms is I want it to resemble combat in the French Revolution and the Napoleonic Wars, which means gunshots in the opening rounds, and then melee combat. There's certainly a push in a few cases for which genres one wants to push their games in, which many people have different preferences for.
    While there were combats like this, it was not how combat in that era looked like. A charge was usually only delivered when the enemy already wavered and often did not even result in a melee. The main way of fighting was done with muskets and there were a lot of different sequences (drills) who fires when to keep up a continuous stream of bullets or to allow manoeuvring without having to stop to fire. Add to that coordinated attacks together with cannons and even rockets.
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  2. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Derren View Post
    While there were combats like this, it was not how combat in that era looked like. A charge was usually only delivered when the enemy already wavered and often did not even result in a melee. The main way of fighting was done with muskets and there were a lot of different sequences (drills) who fires when to keep up a continuous stream of bullets or to allow manoeuvring without having to stop to fire. Add to that coordinated attacks together with cannons and even rockets.
    This is where genre conventions come in over other concerns, what's described here is mass combat and while I'd certainly would like to think about mass combat rules (which I'm not satisfied with any of the iterations from Unearthed Arcana), there's also the D&D (or any RPG) conceit that many character vs character encounters aren't going to be starting from 100's of feet away. If PCs are involved, then things are going to be within melee range relatively soon, and that's not counting the involvement of magic and all sorts of special things PCs can do.
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  3. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by tglassy View Post
    OMG, we're saying if you want to care if it's realistic then you need to care that ALL of it is realistic, not cherry pick things just cause you don't want it in your game.
    No, that's just not true.

  4. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrim View Post
    No, that's just not true.
    So why should we have to create an entirely new, hyperrelaistic hyperspecific hypernloated system for weapon accuracy, damage, and reloading for one specific wepaon type, rather than adapting it into the already existing 5e weapon system? Why do you care so much about a firearm being hyperrealistic when swords and crossbows aren't? Why are people arguing for increased system bloat?
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  5. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psyzhran2357 View Post
    So why should we have to create an entirely new, hyperrelaistic hyperspecific hypernloated system for weapon accuracy, damage, and reloading for one specific wepaon type
    No one is suggesting you have to do anything.

  6. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrim View Post
    No one is suggesting you have to do anything.

    Have you even read the last few pages of the thread? Do you even know ehat the current argument is about?

  7. #117
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    How I handle firearms in my 3.5 pirate campaign, is to make them clearly better than regular D&D weapons. They do more damage, can fire multiple shots, and do triple damage on a crit. They can also be combined with weapon-specific feats/abilities, such as using the Quickdraw feat to draw multiple preloaded pistols in a round and fire them. You need to give firearms a strong advantage, or players won't bother to use them, and at higher levels you may even need to introduce magical or mastercrafted guns as loot.

    However, in order to make melee not totally useless, there need to be drawbacks aswell, such as: reloading costs a full round, players must have gunpowder and ammo, and firearms need to stay dry. In a campaign that includes a lot of water, that last one is a big deal. The moment you go for a swim, that gun is rendered useless. I also use a misfire table that can cause guns to jam, break or explode!
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  8. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrim View Post
    No, that's just not true.
    Yes, that just is true.

  9. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Imaculata View Post
    You need to give firearms a strong advantage, or players won't bother to use them, and at higher levels you may even need to introduce magical or mastercrafted guns as loot.
    I think I'd disagree. A lot of players spend significant time eking out even a minor advantage based weapons and combos. If your firearms are even slightly superior then everyone will use them unless "story reasons". So sure. I think balance is way more important than selling the idea to the players.
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  10. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by tglassy View Post
    OMG, we're saying if you want to care if it's realistic then you need to care that ALL of it is realistic, not cherry pick things just cause you don't want it in your game.
    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrim View Post
    No, that's just not true.
    Quote Originally Posted by Psyzhran2357 View Post
    So why should we have to create an entirely new, hyperrelaistic hyperspecific hypernloated system for weapon accuracy, damage, and reloading for one specific wepaon type, rather than adapting it into the already existing 5e weapon system? Why do you care so much about a firearm being hyperrealistic when swords and crossbows aren't? Why are people arguing for increased system bloat?
    Quote Originally Posted by tglassy View Post
    Yes, that just is true.
    No, it is not true. If you're running the game and introducing firearms, you get to decide exactly how realistic their implementation is, and which bits of realism you incorporate.

    If you want to make revolvers 2d8 damage superweapons because that is "realistic", you are not also required to apply sound-based perception penalties after firing one just because that would also be "realistic".
    You do get to cherry pick things that you want in your game.
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