Another Look at the D&D Essentials Kit

Here's a closer look at the upcoming D&D Essentials Kit.


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D&D Essentials Kit (September 3rd; June 24th in the US)
Boxed Set

Everything you need to create characters and play the new adventures in this introduction to the world’s greatest roleplaying game.

Dungeons & Dragons is a cooperative storytelling game that harnesses your imagination and invites you to explore a fantastic world of adventure, where heroes battle monsters, find treasures, and overcome quests. The D&D Essentials Kitis a new introductory product meant to bring D&D to audiences interested in jumping into a fantasy story.

This box contains the essentials you need to run a D&D game with one Dungeon Master and one to five adventurers. A newly designed rulebook on-boards players by teaching them how to make characters, and the included adventure, Dragon of Icespire Peak, introduces a new 1-on-1 rules variant.
 

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DMZ2112

Chaotic Looseleaf
Yes. Provided it was programed with the ability to do so by a GOOD DM in the first place.

Regardless, any player who encounters that program in the future is going to have the same set of experiences, with no variation, regardless of how validated those experiences make them feel.

It's not just about that but... those are like 2 reaaally important DMing skills that not everyone bothers to pick up.

I don't really think there are objective measures of dungeon mastery. I think there are excellent dungeon masters who are mechanical experts, master storytellers, talented world builders, or gifted people managers. I don't think anyone succeeds at all four perfectly, and I don't think competency in all four is necessary to be a great dungeon master. Ultimately, the only metric that matters is whether or not your players respond positively to your style.

Several things here. If you fudge, your players won't earn a thing. You are the one that's choosing when they succeed and when they fail. Their characters don't have input in the resolution of your encounters. You're just playing with yourself. Let the guy who's a "super climber" (or the wizard who prepared Spider Climb or whatever) defeat the wall encounter in an objective manner if they are able.

This is the first pitfall folks encounter when discussing this with me. If you tie the act of fudging to a single roll, it always appears inadvisable. There is no right time to fudge. I am the first person to agree. Fudging is a devastating responsibility that should never be undertaken lightly, for instance simply to allow a player to succeed at a task where they would otherwise have failed. That is counter to the rules and spirit of the game.

The problem is that the game has no single rolls. Every roll exists in a continuum of events, some of which involve rolling and some of which don't. Let me give you a more nuanced example.

Your PCs are negotiating the release of a prisoner. The captors are hostile, but the party's bard is talented both in terms of the player's natural abilities and the numbers on their character sheet (normally, I'd point out the former is irrelevant, but since the numbers don't contradict, it's fine to let them flex a little player aptitude). You're having a good session, and you feel like you've held your own -- the captors' leader has been unreasonably tough but receptive to the bard's generosity and etiquette.

When there have been close calls, rolls have been made throughout the exchange, which has gone on for the better part of a session. Some rolls have gone in the favor of the captors, others in favor of the party. None of them have been finally decisive (and none of them have been fudged). Your social players are eating it up, but your more combat-minded players are starting to wonder when they're going to get to flex some muscle. You're at a strong climax, and it is time to wrap this up.

You decide the captors are willing but not eager to release their prisoner, after considering all the build up, and set a hard-earned Persuasion DC of 15. You keep this to yourself and tell the bard's player to roll one last time. Their final result is a 14.

All things being equal, that is a failure. Two hours of intensive roleplay and strategy are wiped away in an instant of random number generation. Fortunately your campaign is well designed, and this does not derail you or your players. Still, while the loss of time and effort might be mitigated for your martially inclined players as they grin and draw steel, it is keenly felt by your roleplayers and particularly by the bard. Everybody gets XP, but there is a sense of a lost opportunity that was thought to have been bought and paid for.

Or maybe there isn't. Or maybe there is and you and your players are fine with that. These are also valid perspectives. But that's really my point: fudging isn't about changing a number on a die, it's about perspective. It's about recognizing what your players want and need and considering that as a part of your practice.

It's about recognizing that your Persuasion DC of 15 is itself arbitrary and subjective, and that if it is a better choice /for your table/ for you to actually have settled on a DC of 14, acknowledging that you are not infallible is a rational and fair response. If it is a better choice /for your table/ for the bard to ultimately succeed after this long and challenging endeavor, you have the ability to make that choice rather than passing the buck to poorly playtested rules written by people you have never met and numbers "randomly" generated by badly thrown and shoddily manufactured plastic blobs.

Because let's be honest, here. No part of this is objective. We create scaffolding to generate the appearance of objectivity, but it's built on sand. The creators of the game have bias, the dice have bias, your players have bias, and you have bias (even if you are not acting on it consciously). Ultimately, what this diagreement comes down to is that I don't see any value in bias that does not improve the enjoyment of my players, so if I am going to be biased anyway -- and indeed, it is unavoidable -- I might as well be biased in the way that seems most productive to me.

That would be an actual accomplishment.

This is the second pitfall. Why is the situation you describe an accomplishment? Because the player rolled high? Because you set the DC low? Certainly, there are roleplaying games where character creation has a greater impact on success at individual tasks than the die roll, but D&D is only one of those games at higher level, where bonuses start to become ludicrous, bounded or not. Even a +5 bonus is virtually meaningless in the face of a 20-point swing, with results ranging from a superhuman 25 to an unremarkable (and almost certainly failing) 6.

Player decisions and actions matter in the long haul, averaged out over time and countless interactions, but not on individual rolls -- which bolsters my point. Sacrificing the "objectivity" of a single roll to enable an outcome just as often can enhance and support player agency as it can negate it.

But if you're looking for the big enemy of player agency, it's not DM fiat, it's the dice.

I love pre-planning complex sessions and complex encounters. I also love improvising and coming up with things on the fly. I am, however, very forward with my players before we begin a game on the subject of what type of game I'll be running.

This is absolutely paramount. You should never fudge at a table where the players are not comfortable with you doing so, and you should always be honest about your intentions. Likewise if you let the dice fall where they may -- I have certainly had players who would have bowed out upon hearing such a declaration.

But I will say that when I encounter players who object to fudging, I advise them to find another table. I consider dungeon master fiat a duty, not a privilege. My players trust me to make their game great and to make their game /theirs/, and I don't have faith in the ability of my lumpen dice and barely edited sourcebooks to do that for them.

Your PC will either climb the wall or not based on the needs of the plot as perceived through the DM's eye, not by her sick climbing skillz.

This is tangentially related to my first point, but bears special notice. What makes you think that I know what the needs of the plot are? I don't know what's going to happen next in my campaigns. That's up to the players. I have undoubtedly planned for a few possible outcomes, but why would I help a PC up a wall to an end that isn't mine to decide?

What's relevant about deciding whether to fudge a specific roll -- and again, I want to be clear that there is no "right time" to fudge, so please don't mistake me -- is whether it is /necessary/ to save the /moment/ for that player, and for the party as a whole. It is common for detractors to cast fudging as a function of railroading, something a dungeon master who ought to be writing a novel rather than running a game does, but I don't see it that way. It's entirely about people, not about plot. It's about seeing what is needful in the now, and standing up and kicking ass instead of phoning it in.

Does fudging impact the future? Of course it does -- every roll in a session affects the next roll, that's what makes this hobby great and what makes the responsibility of sitting behind the screen so damn devastating. You have to be so careful when you bend the rules. But if you don't bend the rules at all, I could replace you with a CPU. In all cases. And I don't believe that's why any of us are here.

tl;dr: Rule 0 has spoiled us as DMs. You don't need rule 0. It robs the players of their agency.

Couldn't disagree more completely. Thank you for engaging!
 

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Ramaster

Adventurer
Thank you for engaging too!

My parting thoughts on this exhausted topic:

If you decide that the negotiation should hinge on a final Persuasion check of DC 15... then why do you allow success on a 14? How is that better than "Mother May I?” The players worked HARD (in out of character energy and in character resources) to get to that point, don't rob them of their agency and effort. If you are not comfortable with the dice resolution system you shouldn't use it. It sometimes develops into these kinds of outcomes... much like real life. I don't think there's anything wrong with picking other resolution methods, mind you. Nor am I insisting that a theoretical purely objective method is strictly better. Apples and oranges. Pick the fruit that tastes better for you and your players. I know which one I would pick. And why.

Backing up a little bit... why did you choose 15 for the Persuasion DC? Different games handle the choosing of the DCs differently. I'm not all that familiar with the 5ed method for assigning DCs, but in Pathfinder, while some subjectivity of course applies, the method is clear cut. The DC for an Unfriendly character to grant a request is 20 + CHA modifier (plus or minus some other mods). If you describe the attitude of the NPC and consider the actions taken previously by the PCs and act in good faith, you can arrive at a relatively accurate, relatively objective (such as it is) DC if you have a definite, discrete definition of all these game terms (“What does being Friendly even mean?”). "After you impressed him on the dinner he is now Friendly (10+CHA), but the help you are asking is putting him at risk, since releasing the prisoner will be seen as an act of weakness by his rivals on the tribe (+10 DC), so roll diplomacy for a final DC of 23 (The NPCs CHA modifier is +3), you have an additional +2 circumstance bonus because you helped the second in command and she put a good word for you".

And if they fail... that's ok! If they had fun doing it I don't see it as having wasted 2 hours, I think it's the opposite, actually. They knew it was difficult going in and that failure was certainly a possible outcome. Now they have to return empty handed and the story continues. Can peace be achieved some other way? Perhaps they can send them tribute and re-negotiate. If they are only interested in releasing the prisoner, then a stealth rescue might be in order. Complications are good things. They make the plot have more verisimilitude.

The deeper point, however, has been reveled through the discussion. And I think addressing it is a great way for BOTH approaches to move forward and it’s something that was not addressed AT ALL on any version of D&D (or Pathfinder, for that matter) except for 4e (that provided a DREADFUL set of mechanics for it): Complex interactions shouldn't be resolved with a single die roll and success shouldn't be a binary issue. Degrees of Success and a relatively comprehensive Skill Challenge system are very much a necessity to adjudicate these kinds of situations. I've been working on a properly playtested Skill Challenge system for Pathfinder that provides Degrees of Success. A usable system will satisfy both approaches.
 
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Thank you for engaging too!

My parting thoughts on this exhausted topic:

If you decide that the negotiation should hinge on a final Persuasion check of DC 15... then why do you allow success on a 14? How is that better than "Mother May I?” The players worked HARD (in out of character energy and in character resources) to get to that point, don't rob them of their agency and effort. If you are not comfortable with the dice resolution system you shouldn't use it. It sometimes develops into these kinds of outcomes... much like real life. I don't think there's anything wrong with picking other resolution methods, mind you. Nor am I insisting that a theoretical purely objective method is strictly better. Apples and oranges. Pick the fruit that tastes better for you and your players. I know which one I would pick. And why.

And then you look at the DMG and see the optional rule: "succeeding at a cost". If a player fails a check by 1 or 2, the DM may have him succeed instead, but also something not so good happens. I like that rule. And I allow my players to actually chose if they want to succeed at a cost sometimes. Like: Boss and last PC are standing face to face, the player has 20 hp left, the boss only 5 or so. The PC misses the boss´s AC by 1.
You could have the player fail or tell him:
The parry movement of your enemy is good enough to defend himself, but you notice, that if you open yourself up for a counter attack, you might have your blade slip past the guard.
 

Urriak

Explorer
I mean okay, cool, I guess that's nice, but that doesn't change what I said: The Lost Mine of Phandelver is being overused, and the fact you're recommending it to others to get into D&D doesn't help. Even if they're getting into it through something that isn't using the adventure, they're going to learn a lot about that adventure and many intro/impromptu events will be ruined because this is the one adventure anyone wants to run without making their own.

I bought the starter set; I read it so I can run D&D for friends. Then I go to a D&D event at my local game store one day and SURPRISE it's the Lost Mine of Phandelver, gotta pretend I don't know this adventure so I don't ruin it for everyone else. A year later it seems like I'll finally run D&D for friends, and then it doesn't happen, but that's okay 'cause AS IT TURNS OUT the Lost Mine of Phandelver was used in the first arc of The Adventure Zone, a podcast that at least two of these said friends are really into, so it's not a terrible loss. Two years after that, work has a D&D night and I get into a game and GUESS WHAT the DM decided to run Lost Mine of Phandelver, which at least 2 other players were familiar with for varying reasons.

At this point I feel like this adventure is only useful if your players have been living under a rock and intend to stay there for the rest of their lives.

(Also, Odyssey of the Dragonlords is based in Greek mythology, which means I was over it before I even learned about it).

This is such a weird complaint. If you think it's being overused, then ask your DM to run something else. Or if you're the DM, run something else.

Phandelver is probably the best adventure for new players to enter D&D, it's explicitly designed for it. If a group of players hasn't played before, who cares if they use it?

Your problem seems to be that either you can't run it because others have played it, or that when you go to other games they happen to be running it. For the former, every single AP in 5th edition starts at level 1 (except Dungeon of the Mad Mage), and most of them are not challenging for the first two levels. For the latter, well you need to play with people other than beginners.
 

MNblockhead

A Title Much Cooler Than Anything on the Old Site
Toy shops are more or less extinct in the US. Indeed, Target is probably the primary toy store in my area at this point, and I am not in the boonies.

Yes, after Toys-R-Us shut down, the main source for most games and toys is probably Walmart and Target. I've read that Kaybee Toys may be making a come back, but its launch was pushed back. Games by James can be found in many malls, but you'd need to make a special trip for "games" rather than just "toys" or "gifts." At a Walmart or a Super Target, you can pick up up groceries, buy clothes, get necessities for the kitchen, common hardware, and you can pick up a birthday/x-mas gift from the toy aisles for your (grand)kid/niece/nephew/kid's schoolmate.

I've actually been impressed with Target's game selection. It is small, but well curated. For hard-core gamers, you are not going to find anything new. But Target is a great way to introduce popular games to new gamers: Catan, Exploding Kittens, Cards Against Humanity, and D&D can be found among Monopoly, Scrabble, Operation, Sorry, and other classics. Target also stocks a decent selection of Magic the Gathering and Pokemon cards, right up next to the check out area.

Target has definitely seen the trends in gaming and an opportunity to sell D&D to someone who only knows it from Big Bang Theory.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
Yes, after Toys-R-Us shut down, the main source for most games and toys is probably Walmart and Target. I've read that Kaybee Toys may be making a come back, but its launch was pushed back. Games by James can be found in many malls, but you'd need to make a special trip for "games" rather than just "toys" or "gifts." At a Walmart or a Super Target, you can pick up up groceries, buy clothes, get necessities for the kitchen, common hardware, and you can pick up a birthday/x-mas gift from the toy aisles for your (grand)kid/niece/nephew/kid's schoolmate.

I've actually been impressed with Target's game selection. It is small, but well curated. For hard-core gamers, you are not going to find anything new. But Target is a great way to introduce popular games to new gamers: Catan, Exploding Kittens, Cards Against Humanity, and D&D can be found among Monopoly, Scrabble, Operation, Sorry, and other classics. Target also stocks a decent selection of Magic the Gathering and Pokemon cards, right up next to the check out area.

Target has definitely seen the trends in gaming and an opportunity to sell D&D to someone who only knows it from Big Bang Theory.

I thought it was fascinating that Target came to WotC looking for a new product, rather than the other way around. That it is also designed around the Target buyer, who wouldn't have the books available, also makes sense as a retailer specific exclusive.
 

The thing about the surviving UK toy shops is they focus on being a kid-friendly environment. They want children to come in, be engaged, and pester their parents to buy them stuff. Ergo anything remotely "adult" is banished.
 

Panda-s1

Scruffy and Determined
This is such a weird complaint. If you think it's being overused, then ask your DM to run something else. Or if you're the DM, run something else.

Phandelver is probably the best adventure for new players to enter D&D, it's explicitly designed for it. If a group of players hasn't played before, who cares if they use it?

Your problem seems to be that either you can't run it because others have played it, or that when you go to other games they happen to be running it. For the former, every single AP in 5th edition starts at level 1 (except Dungeon of the Mad Mage), and most of them are not challenging for the first two levels. For the latter, well you need to play with people other than beginners.

very few people have the luxury to just ask the DM to run something else.

you also seem to be missing the part where thanks to the D&D boom and modern media (y'know livestreaming and podcasts) people will know about what happens in the adventure before ever setting out to play D&D for the first time. sure it's a great adventure for beginners (idk how many times I have to say this) but a first adventure is kinda useless if the players already know what's gonna happen in it.

also not everyone has the luxury to have a set RPG group. it's been almost 2 years since my regular group has gotten to meet, so I'll go to a single day D&D event if I can, but most of these events will be beginner friendly and therefore be at first level and guess what every DM thinks is a good first level adventure to run lol

I thought it was fascinating that Target came to WotC looking for a new product, rather than the other way around. That it is also designed around the Target buyer, who wouldn't have the books available, also makes sense as a retailer specific exclusive.

I mean Target did have a few exclusive Catan games, iirc the first one was Star Trek Catan back in like 2010 when boardgames started becoming popular in the US.
 

Urriak

Explorer
very few people have the luxury to just ask the DM to run something else.

you also seem to be missing the part where thanks to the D&D boom and modern media (y'know livestreaming and podcasts) people will know about what happens in the adventure before ever setting out to play D&D for the first time. sure it's a great adventure for beginners (idk how many times I have to say this) but a first adventure is kinda useless if the players already know what's gonna happen in it.

also not everyone has the luxury to have a set RPG group. it's been almost 2 years since my regular group has gotten to meet, so I'll go to a single day D&D event if I can, but most of these events will be beginner friendly and therefore be at first level and guess what every DM thinks is a good first level adventure to run lol

I've been going to a drop-in drop-out D&D meetup for about 3 months now, specifically designed for beginners. Not once has anyone run Phandelver.

If you can't find a DM who isn't creative enough to run something other than the adventure in the starter's box, that sounds more like your problem than Phandelver's. It's designed for new people, it's in the starter's box, and it's good so of course it's going to popular.

Now if the DM is facing a group of people who have either played or seen people play Phandelver, he should probably buck up and run something else. But if he's introducing people to the game, it's a pretty good game to start with.
 

Prakriti

Hi, I'm a Mindflayer, but don't let that worry you
If you can't find a DM who isn't creative enough to run something other than the adventure in the starter's box, that sounds more like your problem than Phandelver's. It's designed for new people, it's in the starter's box, and it's good so of course it's going to popular.
You seem to think that Panda-s1 is bashing Lost Mine of Phandelver. He's not. He's simply welcoming the release of a new Start Set, because it means that new players will have more options for getting into the game.
 

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