D&D 4E How To Clone 4E Using 5E Rules

jmartkdr · May 25, 2019

Charlaquin said:
For me, it’s about wanting to see 4e design iterated and improved upon. If I want to play 4e I can play 4e. I moved on from 4e though, because while there are aspects of it that I think got thrown out with the bath water, the overall experience does feel very 2010 to me. What I want is a 2019 evolution of 4e. Something that takes the best parts of 4e and brings them into a more streamlined, approachable, modern system. I want the 5e from the alternate universe where 4e sold gangbusters. And the 5e from this universe is probably the best baseline to work from to make that. Certainly it has a broader pool of potentially interested players than “hey guys, want to play my heavily houseruled version of 4e?”

I assume you've looked into 13th Age? It's very much, in many ways, an attempt to be exactly this.

It didn't quite hit the sweet spot for me (because it goes all-in on the TotM among other things) but it seems to work for a lot of people.

Retreater · May 25, 2019

Charlaquin said:
For me, it’s about wanting to see 4e design iterated and improved upon. If I want to play 4e I can play 4e. I moved on from 4e though, because while there are aspects of it that I think got thrown out with the bath water, the overall experience does feel very 2010 to me. What I want is a 2019 evolution of 4e. Something that takes the best parts of 4e and brings them into a more streamlined, approachable, modern system. I want the 5e from the alternate universe where 4e sold gangbusters. And the 5e from this universe is probably the best baseline to work from to make that. Certainly it has a broader pool of potentially interested players than “hey guys, want to play my heavily houseruled version of 4e?”

I'm a fellow 4e apologist here. In fact, I've been running two 4e campaigns recently and modding my creature design in another 5e game to reflect 4e paradigms - I think to good success.

I've tried 13th Age, and it also didn't hit that sweet spot of 4e play. Particularly, the Icon dice and inflating damage dice didn't fit my game style.

I think that the way to do it is to identify those design decisions that you liked about 4e and start from the ground up for your dream game. For me, these would be class balance, monster design, and robust tactical combat.

I wouldn't expect you would need WotC's blessing to release your own originally designed system.

Charlaquin · May 25, 2019

Retreater said:
I'm a fellow 4e apologist here. In fact, I've been running two 4e campaigns recently and modding my creature design in another 5e game to reflect 4e paradigms - I think to good success.

I've tried 13th Age, and it also didn't hit that sweet spot of 4e play. Particularly, the Icon dice and inflating damage dice didn't fit my game style.

I think that the way to do it is to identify those design decisions that you liked about 4e and start from the ground up for your dream game. For me, these would be class balance, monster design, and robust tactical combat.

I wouldn't expect you would need WotC's blessing to release your own originally designed system.

I feel quite the same. I have often considered just building my ideal system from the ground up, but man does that sound like a lot of work for something that would likely be too specifically tailored to my own tastes to be able to find an audience for.

Morrus · May 25, 2019

Charlaquin said:
I feel quite the same. I have often considered just building my ideal system from the ground up, but man does that sound like a lot of work for something that would likely be too specifically tailored to my own tastes to be able to find an audience for.

You just described the OSR movement! Except that quite often, they do find an audience.

Hussar · May 25, 2019

ccs said:
Why would you want to do this? The point of 5e is that it's not 4e.

But hey, if this project keeps you busy enough so you don't rant about Star Wars, go for it.

And the wonder is, they managed to convince folks that this was true.

The Crimson Binome · May 25, 2019

Charlaquin said:
I feel quite the same. I have often considered just building my ideal system from the ground up, but man does that sound like a lot of work for something that would likely be too specifically tailored to my own tastes to be able to find an audience for.

If you're starting from an established system, and you're just introducing a couple of wide-reaching changes to the system, then it shouldn't take you much more than six months. Remember, you don't have to translate all of the content immediately, as long as you establish how you would translate later on.

As for finding an audience, I honestly think you'd have a better chance finding players for a new game that nobody had ever heard of, rather than an established game which has been discontinued. The only one you really need to sell on it is yourself.

Retreater · May 25, 2019

How I'd sell someone on a 4e-inspired system:

"Command the battlefield with beguiling illusions. Sharpen your rapier for a precision strike. Become a hero of legend in cooperative quests that will challenge you to think tactically against powerful foes. Go forth ... to adventure!

"Streamlined, intuitive rules guide parties of adventurers through robust tactical challenges, while providing Game Masters with the tools they need to create dangerous dungeons and perilous quests."

Morrus · May 25, 2019

Turning it into a “dungeon delve” system is the way to go. One-session tactical modules.

Retreater · May 25, 2019

Morrus said:
Turning it into a “dungeon delve” system is the way to go. One-session tactical modules.

But with the ability for interconnected, longer campaigns. Along the lines of Frostgrave?

Morrus · May 25, 2019

Retreater said:
But with the ability for interconnected, longer campaigns. Along the lines of Frostgrave?

You could choose your own publishing strategy, of course. If it were me, I’d be more focused and specific. I’d go single one-shot skirmish encounters with a range of parameters. I’d look at some of FFGs Star Wars skirmish stuff.