D&D 5E So...keelboats

FitzTheRuke · Jun 2, 2019

I was doing some research on the ships, and I was trying to decide between doing what *I* consider to be the most "definitive" versions of them for my deck plans, or making sure that they match your descriptions. (The Cog is a good example - most Cogs I can find don't have a forecastle, so the Sea Ghost is a bit strange for a Cog - though I have no problem with it being the Caravel. If you prefer the deck plan to be the same for both, I guess I'll try to make them match your descriptions.

If I'm going to create the art fully by myself, as opposed to modifying the existing stuff, I can make it similar to the Sea Ghost, so it matches your description, while making it not exactly the same. (Also, I don't think there's any reason to actually make a map for the bilge.)

Hussar · Jun 2, 2019

If you're looking for ship battlemaps, here's a bunch:

https://www.reddit.com/r/5eNavalCampaigns/comments/bhg6o7/ship_battle_map_megapost/

And a super excellent tutorial for building ships in whatever art program you are using:

https://www.reddit.com/r/5eNavalCam..._minute_tabletop_build_your_own_sailing_ship/

FitzTheRuke · Jun 2, 2019

While I was looking at the GoS sample ships for inspiration, I noticed more shoddy editing. The Sailing Ship, for example is listed as 100' long but the deck plan has it only 16 squares (80' long). The map of the Sea Ghost has it at 85. Actually bigger than the sailing ship, which I find amusing. (I don't mean any of this as a particularly big deal, it's just... what it is.)

FitzTheRuke · Jun 2, 2019

77IM said:
I couldn't help myself: More Ships of the Sea

I can whip up the deck plans from Ghosts of Saltmarsh and modify them the way you describe in your documents quick as can be. Trouble is, I'm stealing all the art bits from whoever drew them in the first place. I don't know who it was, either.

But check it out: Here's your "Schooner". (In addition to your notes, I ditched the Privy. I think it's weird, and I gave the ship an armory, as the #13 is usually described in GoS. Oh and I added a bowsprit.)

77IM · Jun 2, 2019

That is amazing! I love it!!!

Regarding the cog: later, larger cogs (like the Sea Ghost, presumably) did have a small forecastle. I'm open to making the cog a slightly smaller ship with no forecastle: the Sea Ghost already has a deck plan so all it really needs is statistics.

Also the caravel should really have two masts (one in the middle, slightly forward, and the other towards the back) because that looks like the most typical sail plan. The cog and the caravel should probably be 60-foot ships, which would make them like oceangoing keelboats.

Speaking of keelboats, the more I looked at this stuff, the less sense the keelboat made. A 60-foot ship that only has a cargo capacity of half a ton is ridiculous. A pickup truck can carry half a ton! Would you be up to the challenge of creating a deck plan for a 30-foot keelboat, say? As a variant deck plan.

The galleon need not mimic the warship so closely, and you can adjust more things on the schooner if you want, too. I was trying to re-use the deck plans in Ghosts of Saltmarsh but if you are able to cook up custom deck plans for these ships we can adjust the statistics to match. For example, later galleons could become quite huge, so we could make it longer than 100 feet; maybe 120 feet.

FitzTheRuke · Jun 2, 2019

I dunno. I'm thinking about hand-drawing a whole bunch of boats and ships myself. I quite like most of what's done in GoS (deck-plan wise, if not always stat-block wise), but I want to add to it without stealing, I think. You can make stat-blocks for what I come up with if you like (I would like it if you did).

FitzTheRuke · Jun 2, 2019

Speaking of Keelboats as they are in GoS, I have come to the absolute conclusion that the designers have been understandably confused by what a modern keelboat is (a small racing vessel that can be crewed by 1-3 people) and what it *was* (a large shallow-bottomed riverboat with 10-20 oars. One of 12 oars, like the deck-plan, would probably need at least 30 crew.)

FitzTheRuke · Jun 2, 2019

So I'm sketching out a bunch of deck plans, and keeping in mind the basic stat-block, and I came to what I am thinking of as the "small keelboat". 30'x10', trying to represent the basics of the stat-block they have in GoS. But I *still* can't see it with 1-3 crew. Sure, I can understand 1-3 people SAILING it, but it's still gonna need 4-8 people to row it, and 1-3 crew for the ballista, if it has one. So it occurs to me that the stations all need individual average and minimum crews. They did this a little bit in their stat-blocks (in some cases, like the Galley, they don't allow for much reduction in crew to row it, for example. It says "minimum 40" rowers, with 32 rowing benches. (With 2 people per bench, you'd imagine a full complement to be 64, perhaps)) In other cases, it's not really mentioned.

Anyway, I think the ideal solution would be to have average and minimum crew per station. You can pull people off of one station and put them on another if you start to run out in a given area. I dunno, maybe I just don't understand the way they mean to do it?

doctorbadwolf · Jun 3, 2019

So, is the keelboat supposed to stand in for pilot boats? Jk obv not, that would be absurd.

I don’t suppose y’all would be willing to stay up a 1-2 crew pilot cutter? My character used to be a harbor pilot in a rough harbor, and I’m curious about the specs translation there. Fast little ships.

Also, how do folks feel about all ships having the same turn speed? Seems to me that it short-sells many of the more maneuverable ships, and tbh maneuverability is one of the pillar factors in choosing a ship in any game.

jasper · Jun 3, 2019

doctorbadwolf said:
So, is the keelboat supposed to stand in for pilot boats? Jk obv not, that would be absurd.

I don’t suppose y’all would be willing to stay up a 1-2 crew pilot cutter? My character used to be a harbor pilot in a rough harbor, and I’m curious about the specs translation there. Fast little ships.

Also, how do folks feel about all ships having the same turn speed? Seems to me that it short-sells many of the more maneuverable ships, and tbh maneuverability is one of the pillar factors in choosing a ship in any game.

I don't think it matters. We are dealing with 6 seconds of combat. So ACCEPT the Wonky.