Jonathan Tweet: Prologue to Third Edition - Page 10
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  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan Tweet View Post
    Omega World: It has a special spot in my heart. I guess I'll cover it.
    Me, too. Thanks. Looking forward to it.

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreyLord View Post
    I still love Omega world. My favorite of the Gamma world types.
    Ditto.
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    Jonathan Tweet: Prologue to Third Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Vyvyan Basterd View Post
    We always pronounced it THAY-CO, rhymes with Waco (Texas).
    Ok. Next question: how do you pronounce Waco (Texas)?

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morrus View Post
    Ok. Next question: how do you pronounce Waco (Texas)?
    Way-Co

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vyvyan Basterd View Post
    Way-Co
    See, I saw that and thought Whacko!
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    THACO rhymes with Thwack-O. Easy to remember.

    Now if you'll excuse me I'll find a jif that expresses this in amusing pop-culture form.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by DerKastellan View Post
    I think each edition of D&D has its virtues and its original sin.

    AD&D 1e: collected the rules in a more organized manner and explained how to run games BUT it abandoned the spirit of "It's your game, make it your own." and moved strongly toward "Play it like I write it, that's best for you." (This is rather well-described in "Dave Arneson't True Genius".)

    AD&D 2e: re-balanced many parts of the game and cut down the rules hodge podge of 1e where e.g. individual monsters had their own (and in my opinion, "improvable") rules. Just as 1e was more designed than original/classical D&D, 2e took it a lot more towards a well-edited game... BUT it changed the fundamental flow of the game by rewarding killing monsters and made it the main activity. (It also introduced feat/proficiency/kit creep but at least it was optional.)(Many people commented that they removed stuff like demons and depictions of summoning circles, making the game bland. I personally wouldn't miss that because it doesn't feature much in my games, YMMV.)

    D&D 3e: introduced, like the AngryGM recently wrote, the single central resolution mechanic. Quite cool stuff and most people would not want to go back before that... BUT it made feats part of the central game, making mechanical building of characters and pre-planning their advances part of D&D. In my opinion it did not add that much to variety because many options were discarded over more powerful ones, and the slew of prestige classes and feats, etc... just too much, just too mechanical. Etc...I personally don't like 3e or Pathfinder much. They certainly did matter for the evolution of D&D and RPG game design but also go away from anything remotely simple. I doubt anyone ever spent as much time looking at their character sheet before 3e as ever after. That's why I call my "BUT"s original sins. You were stuck with them after, they never went away.

    Monster-killing is now core and center in D&D. Thanks 2e. And no edition since 3e has dared to keep characters even remotely as simple as before 3e. Dungeon Crawl Classics is a good example how the raw power of 3e's core can be combined with a select few mechanics to create a slim D&D experience powerhouse. Because it's 3e without exploding feat-mania on top. (Except magic. Every D&D-like game has broken magic. And 6e won't fix that.)

    Every such lesson is learned the hard way. I'm glad people can take from OGL 3e and 5e what they need to build new games because many good ideas are contained within the history of D&D.I might not like playing 3e (simply because tastes vary), but I'm glad it was made and exists.
    Fixed it for readability.
    Last edited by Mistwell; Friday, 7th June, 2019 at 11:51 PM.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by DEFCON 1 View Post
    Who the heck would want to eat tacos while reading a book of that size? You're just asking to stain the pages when all the tacos stuff falls out onto it while you're eating!
    And yet even then the book would remain intact. Those things were built like friggin' tanks.

    (In a bizarre coincidence, I am right now eating tacos as I read through my 1E DMG.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by kenmarable View Post
    Like, if they were these strange creatures, they wouldn't call themselves something as lame as "devils."
    Whereas I think that any Demon or Devil worth its salt would absolutely revel in the name, and all of the historical, cultural, and religious connotations that come with it. Some rando peasant isn't going to have the slightest idea what in the Hell a Baatezu is, but he will damn well know what a Devil is and know to absolutely not cross it on peril of his immortal soul.

    The trouble with the terms Tanar'ri and Baatezu is what is known as "Calling a Rabbit a Smeerp" on TVTropes. Your characters are going out to hunt small, furry creatures with long ears and cotton-puff tails that hop around. Are they hunting rabbits? Nope, they're hunting smeerps! It's an attempt to gain the benefits of all the pre-existing cultural connotations of a known creature or mythological entity except, instead of calling it what it is, calling it a weird, made up science fiction name in a lazy attempt at "adding flavor."

    In other words, Baatezu "Not Devils" are a type of Evil supernatural entity known for being ruthlessly clever ultimate "evil lawyer" archetypes, infamous for making supernatural legal contracts with mortals who trade their souls in exchange for magic and temporal power... and they're from Hell where they preside over the souls of the damned (or Baator "Not Hell.") But they're not Devils... because.


    I did like how 3rd Edition handled the problem by making Tanar'ri and Baatezu specific subtypes, with the terms Demon and Devil referring to any native inhabitant of the Abyss and the Hells respectively.
    Last edited by Aaron L; Saturday, 8th June, 2019 at 02:39 AM.

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hussar View Post
    We always pronounced it thaco, as in rhyming with taco.
    Our a was flatter; instead the term rhymed with wacko.

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