Let's Talk About THAC0

Morrus · Jun 6, 2019

Dausuul said:
In my experience, THAC0 doesn't have a reputation at all, if by "reputation" you mean "opinion held by people without direct knowledge." People either know what THAC0 is because they played 2E, or they didn't play 2E and have never heard of it.

That’s not my experience.

lowkey13 · Jun 6, 2019

*Deleted by user*

Joshua Randall · Jun 6, 2019

It's not an "argument" that addition is easier than subtraction. It's a proven fact.

Also, it's not an "argument" that consistency makes it easier for people to learn (higher numbers always better). That's also a proven fact.

THAC0 fails both and belongs in the dustbin of history.

jasper · Jun 6, 2019

I proclaim THAC20 for 6E

Umbran · Jun 6, 2019

Morrus said:
I hope another dozen people explain to me that addition is easier than subtraction!

Be careful what you wish for...

Nevertheless, I still maintain my position that THAC0 is not as complex as it’s reputation would lead you to believe, whether or not addition is easier than subtraction.

Are you sure the reputation is "more complex", and not just "more confusing"?

But, note that in your explanation, you left out a step:

In 3E-5E, you roll d20 and add bonuses in order to beat the target's AC.

In 1E-2E, you roll d20 and add bonuses (Strength, magic, etc) in order to beat THAC0 minus AC.

So, in 3E-5E, you do one mathematical operation, on the roll total. In 1E-2E you generally do two - one on the die, one on the target number. And that "minus AC" in general also included the fact that the AC could be a negative number.

Whether you decide that this is not "as complex as its reputation". It does literally require more operations.

lowkey13 · Jun 6, 2019

*Deleted by user*

Morrus · Jun 6, 2019

Umbran said:
Whether you decide that this is not "as complex as its reputation". It does literally require more operations.

And yet I stand by my assertion. It is not as complex (or, indeed, confusing) as it’s reputation.

Umbran · Jun 6, 2019

lowkey13 said:
For forty-three years of my conscious life I have remained a revolutionist; for forty-two of them I have fought under the banner of THAC0. If I had to begin all over again I would of course try to avoid this or that mistake, but the main course of my life would remain unchanged.

I shall die an AD&D revolutionist, a THAC0ist, a dialectical Gygaxian, and, consequently, an irreconcilable grognard.

My faith in the tablist future of Dungeons and Dragons and in constancy of THAC0 is not less ardent, indeed it is firmer today, than it was in the days of my youth.

That's nice. Do you still use a rotary-dial phone, too? Drive a car that uses leaded gasoline? Listen to a lot of The Captain and Tennille?