I only run D&D when I need to establish a player base

Rory Fansler · Jul 12, 2019

Finding a local group can be hard so joining a Pathfinder/D&D game is easier. Once you have a relationship then you can try convincing them to try another system. Odds are though they will prefer whats familiar rather than try something new.

Blue · Jul 12, 2019

Currently, D&D 5e is the game played by the most gamers I want to hang out with. Considering player availability and scheduling (we're well into adulthood, lots with families and kids), finding critical mass of people who are all into the same non-D&D game is hard.

We set up a group playing D&D. But now that the first campaign is over and we're still together as a group, we tried Dungeon World, we talked about 7th Sea, and while next is planned more 5e, as a group it's easier to get people to do something new then it would be to get a bunch of individual players to agree on a system and scheduling.

Being a good game that also has a wide player base makes it easier to get a group together in the first place.

Ralif Redhammer · Jul 12, 2019

Wouldn’t trade it for the world! When we’re both players, one of us tends to play the straight man and the other goes more eccentric. One of us might play the stodgy dwarf, the other a French halfling, or one an egomaniacal germophobe space wizard and the other an emotionless android.

Back in the day, we were in a band together. When we were on the same page, everything came together great. But when we weren’t, then it got bad. We were open and raw about it, and it fell to the other bandmates to moderate that.

Getting back to the subject at hand, when we had more time, it was easier to juggle multiple campaigns of different games. Now, D&D is the easiest to recruit for. But it's also the easiest to keep going. Switching to something else, for me, always has to be weighed against that – is the time to get everyone to learn the rules and get on board with it worth it?

Xaelvaen said:
First, playing with a like-minded twin must be badass, at least it seems that way in my head haha. Crazy high jinks abundant!

Ratskinner · Jul 13, 2019

hmm...

I've found that D&D is the "gateway drug" for forming a new group, especially among crusty old folks like me. I've also found that groups like my current group (~80% old guys with the occasional young'un joining for a while) tend to forget all the things they hate about D&D. We play D&D for a while, get frustrated, play a campaign in another system or three, rinse and repeat. I have failed multiple times to create a new group advertising other systems (Fate, Gumshoe, etc.)

However, I have not noticed the same process with my kids and their friend groups when they play. They tend to look at the friend group first, the game second. Fate works just great for them.

GMMichael · Jul 13, 2019

Morrus said:
Where did you hear/see that assertion, out of curiosity?

From the "Why do you play games other than D&D" thread, I believe.

Celebrim said:
And thinking about it, I'd probably be much happier going to play D&D with a strange group than I would most other systems because you really never know what you are going to get with a group, and D&D is at least some sort of baseline.

D&D's new slogan:

"At least some sort of baseline."

Seriously though, that makes sense. If I'm not going to know the people playing, I might as well know the game.

uzirath · Jul 13, 2019

DMMike said:
What's this establishing-a-player-base? Do you, as GM, curate a game group? Do you, as a player, play D&D just long enough to find other players who match or complement your playing style?

I regularly invite people to play TRPGs, but I don't use D&D as the gateway. The system we use depends on circumstances. I often recruit people who are new to RPGs; teaching them D&D is no easier than DFRPG (for example), so I usually start with what I prefer. They've usually heard of D&D, of course, so it helps somewhat that I'll be using the same heroic fantasy genre. (One of the reasons I dropped D&D as my preferred system was because new players kept asking to play character concepts that didn't exist and were hard to build without a toolbox system like GURPS.) I do run and play D&D games sometimes, but that's usually with established groups (i.e., jumping in to DM a side quest), or because we want to run a published adventure without bothering to convert it. Contrary to what I hear on the forums a lot, most gamers that I know are open to trying other games as players. GMing a new system is a different matter because it requires such an investment of time (and money), but most are happy to try any game that someone else volunteers to run.

Have you been told that you're not welcome in a group? Or worse, have you been told that a group was disbanding, just to find them playing another session without you?

I've never been explicitly booted, but I've certainly walked away from groups where the chemistry didn't feel right (and I may have been on track to be dis-invited eventually). In my own games, over many years, I think I've explicitly removed three players. All of these were due to critical differences in play style, genre expectations, etc. Interestingly, I continued playing with all three people in other contexts (i.e., them GMing, different genres, entirely different groups, etc.) and they were great. They just weren't a good fit in my long-running campaigns and were causing other players a lot of grief.

uzirath · Jul 13, 2019

I just remembered, too, that back in high school we had such a large circle of gamers that some of the GMs would hold tryout sessions before forming a new group. Good role-playing was the key element being judged. Usually about half the people who "auditioned" would make the cut. There was much drama and angst about this, so I don't recommend it, but it did encourage people to flesh out their characters. Heh.

dragoner · Jul 13, 2019

My drinking team has a gaming problem. Used to be games were a good excuse to drink beer, now it is drinking beer is a good reason to play games. Real life group, online it's just the perpetual game: if it weren't for NPC's I'd have no reason to be there at all. The face to face group we usually play at pubs, and the establishments are pretty happy to have us at a table, we're low effort customers. D&D fed me into the churn back in the day, and I suppose I should be thankful of that, however there is a huge difference between games I want to play and games I will run. I mean I can introduce a game, and the others will be like "are you going to run it?" Then they will play, and the same goes for someone else running a game.

aramis erak · Jul 13, 2019

Morrus said:
Where did you hear/see that assertion, out of curiosity?

He's directly quoting me from another thread. I don't recall if that thread is here or at RPGGeek.

When one prefers to GM, it's easiest to get player trust by running systems familiar to them. One can then find out who is interested.

I'd rather have a game of D&D going than no game at all; I'd rather play (insert list of over 100 other games) than D&D, and If stuck running D&D, my preferences in D&D are limited to Cyclopedia/BECMI/BX and 5E at this time. I'd quit gaming entirely if my only options were pre-4E, and 4E is just too much hassle to GM.

Building a base of people who have seen that I can and do run fun games, and how I approach rules makes it easier to recruit for those other 100 games

GMMichael · Jul 14, 2019

aramis erak said:
Building a base of people who have seen that I can and do run fun games, and how I approach rules makes it easier to recruit for those other 100 games

Aha. See, now I'm picturing you wearing a green beret somewhere in Africa. The locals are having political problems, and bringing D&D games into their village is how you will lift the oppressive banner of non-role-playing entertainment. De oppresso liber.

Rory Fansler said:
Finding a local group can be hard so joining a Pathfinder/D&D game is easier. Once you have a relationship then you can try convincing them to try another system. Odds are though they will prefer whats familiar rather than try something new.

Just wait 'til Pathfinder 2 hits. Yikes. Running D&D makes sense to me for establishing a base of n00bs, but I bet you can stray from that Path if you're looking for more experienced players. Any of the bigger-named games that aren't D&D would probably work for that goal.