D&D General Does Your Fantasy Race Really Matter In Game? (The Gnome Problem)

Shadowdweller · Jul 17, 2019

From a gaming standpoint, I think the myriad races serve an important and valuable role. In some ways BECAUSE of the stereotypes: They provide a scaffold (much like Class and in 5e, Background) with which to develop a personality. Not, of course, that people can't roleplay WITHOUT race. But given the hordes of individuals who either don't roleplay a consistent character or roleplay with the finesse of a two-by-four (i.e. none at all), I'm happy to have even terrible stereotypes. I much prefer them to two-by-fours amongst my playgroups. Despite any potential overlap in role and character between individual races (/species), there are always differences between them. Is it ever actually beneficial to decrease the number of available colors in your palette?

Here's a DMing tip though: If a player wants to use a race that you think just doesn't fit in your game world, consider asking them whether it's the mechanical aspects or the lore about it that appeal to them; and then consider which part of their request doesn't seem to fit. Because it's trivially easy to reskin one race as a variation or subrace of another. Perhaps halflings in your game world are really a type of gnome. Or vise versa. Half-orcs could actually be a type of genasi.

Shadowdweller · Jul 17, 2019

Zardnaar said:
New race though, I don't mind people wrecking their own stuff.

Kender don't usually confine themselves to their own stuff. That abomination is tailor-made for griefing.

Zardnaar · Jul 17, 2019

Shadowdweller said:
Kender don't usually confine themselves to their own stuff. That abomination is tailor-made for griefing.

Yeah Lenders are more or less the worst race ever. Never really like DL as a Gameworld and it's a bit meh in terms of novels, way to hit or miss and even in the 90s the main DL novels hadn't aged well IMHO.

Krynn needs to be interdicted both in Spelljammer and Planescape. Keep Lenders there.

Paul Farquhar · Jul 17, 2019

Matthia05718273 said:
I largely agree with this take, especially when compared to halflings (or hobbits).

Halflings are usually considered to be living in the countryside, happy and content, and not too interested in adventure (you know, hobbits). The adventurer hobbit is the odd-one-out who is tired of that and goes out on an adventure to see the world; he's the exception, not the rule.

The gnome is similar in appearance, and sometimes in their environment (countryside and quaint homes), but that's it. The gnome is erratic, hyperactive, energetic. They are curious, inventive, and unfocused. Either they're tinkering away on a new invention, or devising a theater production that is dazzling in both sound and lights.

The problem with this isn't the cultures, which are actually pretty different. It's the adventurer, as the hobbit adventurer is usually depicted as the exception to his race, the gnome is the norm. And then they end up overlapping even more in behavior.

Tldr: Halflings are hobbits, gnomes are smurfs.

There are no halfling companions in BG2 or NWN2, but their are a couple in BG1. One is a psychopath and the other is saccharine. The one in Pathfinder: Kingmaker also leans to saccharine.

We have a gnome an a halfing PC in one of my games. The gnome is played as a bit of a kook, but the halfing is indistinguishable from a small human. But that's how Tolkien wrote them, so I don't see it as a problem. Several of the D&D races are basically just exotic humans - half elves, tieflings etc. But some are rather more alien, such as gnomes and elves (when played well).

Bottom line, I don't really see a problem. Some races give players the chance to play an truly alien character, whilst others are pretty much humans with gameplay quirks. And that's the difference between gnomes and halflings.

Arnwolf666 · Jul 17, 2019

Generally I DM human only settings. Although I let players choose a race purely for their mechanics. We just call them variant humans. Amazing how no one really cared about race once I gave them all the mechanical benefits. I do more homebrew settings anyway.

Kurotowa · Jul 17, 2019

Shadowdweller said:
From a gaming standpoint, I think the myriad races serve an important and valuable role. In some ways BECAUSE of the stereotypes: They provide a scaffold (much like Class and in 5e, Background) with which to develop a personality. Not, of course, that people can't roleplay WITHOUT race. But given the hordes of individuals who either don't roleplay a consistent character or roleplay with the finesse of a two-by-four (i.e. none at all), I'm happy to have even terrible stereotypes. I much prefer them to two-by-fours amongst my playgroups. Despite any potential overlap in role and character between individual races (/species), there are always differences between them. Is it ever actually beneficial to decrease the number of available colors in your palette?

As I've said before, there's nothing wrong with cliches. If it wasn't a powerful story element then it would never have become a cliche in the first place. No, the problem is with lazily executed cliches where only the shallow surface details are present. Lazy cliches are the copypaste image macro of the narrative world. It was great when it was fresh and new, and it can be again if someone puts some real effort into it, but lots of people just spam the low effort version that quickly wears out its welcome.

So there's nothing wrong with leaning into the racial cliches, or at least using them as a foundation before you flesh out their personality and add in a fresh twist or two. Everything has to start somewhere.

jasper · Jul 17, 2019

Shadowdweller said:
It treated kender as a far worse joke.

Kender were proof that the gawds were still around Krynn. Any law abiding town would shot kender on sight, and arrested their companions for bring dangerous animals into town.

jasper · Jul 17, 2019

Shadowdweller said:
..
Here's a DMing tip though: If a player wants to use a race that you think just doesn't fit in your game world, consider asking them whether it's the mechanical aspects or the lore about it that appeal to them; and then consider which part of their request doesn't seem to fit. Because it's trivially easy to reskin one race as a variation or subrace of another. Perhaps halflings in your game world are really a type of gnome. Or vise versa. Half-orcs could actually be a type of genasi.

Another DM tip, tell the player the race is not allowed in your campaign. If they can't accept that tell them you see them on taco Thursday.

jgsugden · Jul 17, 2019

It doesn't sound like a lot of DMs out there separate race and culture.

In my games, the culture from which a character originaes has more to do with their personality than their race. Sure, there are racial impacts as well as certain 5E races have a 'high tendency' to have particular traits, but I do not play those as absolute rules, and quite often go across the norm as a role playing decision. The various books describe Halflings as curious, superstitious, kind and practical... even a bit simple. However, these traits are not common for all of my halflings. The halflings that exist is a dread empire where people disappear from their beds in the middle of the night if they stand out tend to not be curious or kind to strangers. Meanwhile, the ones that exist in the nation where everyone is educated in basic magic are not superstitious, nor are they interested in the simple relaxing pleasures of a quaint farming life.

It really isn't that hard to make meaningful differences for your PCs origin, but it doesn't have to be all about that race.

the Jester · Jul 17, 2019

Shadowdweller said:
Is it ever actually beneficial to decrease the number of available colors in your palette?

You sure can make a muddy mess when you throw every color on the canvas.

Shadowdweller said:
Here's a DMing tip though: If a player wants to use a race that you think just doesn't fit in your game world, consider asking them whether it's the mechanical aspects or the lore about it that appeal to them; and then consider which part of their request doesn't seem to fit. Because it's trivially easy to reskin one race as a variation or subrace of another. Perhaps halflings in your game world are really a type of gnome. Or vise versa. Half-orcs could actually be a type of genasi.

This can work, sure. Or, as an alternative, explain that you don't allow said race, that it doesn't fit into the setting, and get your players to stay inside the lines.

The problem with reflavoring is that it waters down the race's identity, and therefore its role in the world and the flavor of the races and cultures the DM has set up. That's fine for some people- especially those who are building their milieu around the party. But for those with an existing setting with a strong identity, it's a terrible solution, because it dilutes exactly what (hopefully) makes that setting strong.