D&D 5E Show me how to build a defender....

Garthanos · Jul 20, 2019

I am currently not happy with the options I have found so far. I might be missing something

DND_Reborn · Jul 20, 2019

For 5E? Do you want a tank? What level? Someone who protects others directly or indirectly? Any particular class or race? More information is required.

Flamestrike · Jul 20, 2019

Vuman Cavalier Fighter [sentinel feat]. Use a halberd for reach.

From 1st level you have Sentinel (AoO if your target moves away (reducing their speed to 0) or attacks someone other than you).
From 3rd level you can 'mark' creatures you attack; they have disadvantage to attack anyone other than you, and if they damage anyone other than you, you get a free attack against them the following round (at advantage, with a slight damage buff, as a bonus action, a few times per day).
At 4th level, take PAM as your feat - you now also gain an AoO when creatures enter your reach.
At 7th level, you get a parry ability to protect yourself or adjacent creatures.
At 10th level, any movement in your reach provokes AoO (and reduces speed to 0).
At 18th level you get an AoO every single turn, allowing an AoO against every single creature that tries to move away from you, enter your reach, or attack anyone else but you.

For feats other than PAM and Sentinel the usual suspects look good. GWM for damage. HAM gives some nice DR. Martial Adept is useful for a Trip attack against a creature entering your reach (reduce speed to 0, trip them, they cant attack you, and then wail on them on your turn). Lucky and Resilient are great as always. Mounted Combat is fluffy but campaign dependent.

Otherwise boost Con, then Strength (and keep your eyes open for a Belt of Giant Strength).

If your DM uses UA and is a fool, take the Tunnel Fighter fighting style. Otherwise Defense style is good.

For MC options, give yourself a Charisma of at least 13 at character creation, and take 3 levels (or more) in Crown Paladin. You gain a 1/ Short rest lock down of all creatures within 30' (they cant move away from you) with your Divine Channel, and access to Compelled Duel as a spell (plus a few Smites).

Also very fluffy.

Krachek · Jul 20, 2019

There is no defender in 5ed. This is a thing of 4ed!

Otherwise, sentinel, cavalier, protection fighting style can give some feeling of 4ed.
I guess you miss warlord too.

GlassJaw · Jul 20, 2019

Stout halfling sword & board bear totem barbarian with the Shield Master feat.

Flamestrike · Jul 20, 2019

I've been trying to whack together a build that forces enemies to attack you (Sentinel, plus 3 levels of Cavalier fighter), while also making it a bad idea to attack you (Armor of Agathys, Hellish Rebuke, Shadows of Moil).

Half Elf [Warlock 9/ Cavalier 4] seems to work pretty good. Blade Pact, Hexblade, Sentinel, HAM, EA + PAM. Bonus points if you have a friendly Cleric nearby to cast Warding Bond on you.

AoA gives you 25 temp HP and deals 25 damage to anyone that hits you. Shadows of Moil gives you advantage to hit (Tri-vantage thanks to EA feat) and disadvantage to be hit, plus it renders you immune to a ton of abilities (seeing as you cant be seen anymore), and it deals +2d8 necrotic to anyone that hits you.

Creatures you threaten have disadvantage to attack anyone other than you (and provoke an AoO and a special bonus action attack from you if they do so). They also provoke an Attack if they leave your reach, or when they enter it.

If they attack you (and you have Warding bond up) it's likely at disadvantage vs a high AC, and even if they hit, they take 25 cold damage (+2d8 necrotic) each time they do.

DND_Reborn · Jul 20, 2019

Flamestrike said:
I've been trying to whack together a build that forces enemies to attack you (Sentinel, plus 3 levels of Cavalier fighter), while also making it a bad idea to attack you (Armor of Agathys, Hellish Rebuke, Shadows of Moil).

Half Elf [Warlock 9/ Cavalier 4] seems to work pretty good. Blade Pact, Hexblade, Sentinel, HAM, EA + PAM. Bonus points if you have a friendly Cleric nearby to cast Warding Bond on you.

AoA gives you 25 temp HP and deals 25 damage to anyone that hits you. Shadows of Moil gives you advantage to hit (Tri-vantage thanks to EA feat) and disadvantage to be hit, plus it renders you immune to a ton of abilities (seeing as you cant be seen anymore), and it deals +2d8 necrotic to anyone that hits you.

Creatures you threaten have disadvantage to attack anyone other than you (and provoke an AoO and a special bonus action attack from you if they do so). They also provoke an Attack if they leave your reach, or when they enter it.

If they attack you (and you have Warding bond up) it's likely at disadvantage vs a high AC, and even if they hit, they take 25 cold damage (+2d8 necrotic) each time they do.

While this is an interesting build, I wonder how effective it is before you reach prime levels. I like the Cav myself for protection builds, and find the Warlock mix interesting. If you will be gaining advantage, maybe adding some levels of Rogue for sneak attack would be good?

Flamestrike · Jul 20, 2019

dnd4vr said:
While this is an interesting build, I wonder how effective it is before you reach prime levels. I like the Cav myself for protection builds, and find the Warlock mix interesting. If you will be gaining advantage, maybe adding some levels of Rogue for sneak attack would be good?

I've been intrested in a 'Porcipine' build for a while.

I had a Fighter 1/ Fiend Blade Lock 7 (V-uman, HAM) who (along with a friendly Cleric with Warding Bond) with Shadows of Mail that was pretty effective.

He had 20 Temp HP from AoA, and reduced damage by 3 (HAM) and then halved it (Resistance from Warding Bond). The latter meant that AoA stayed 'up' for multiple encounters, dealing damage on each hit (plus 2d8 damage from Shadows of Moil).

Presume a Hobgoblin Warlord attacks me (and hits 3 times with its Multiattack):

Attack 1: 21 damage (martial advantage). Reduced to 18 (HAM) and then halved (Warding Bond) to 9.
Attack 2: 7 damage. Reduced to 4 (HAM) and then halved to 2.
Attack 3: 7 damage. Reduced to 4 (HAM) and then halved to 2.

I lose 13 temp HP. The Warlord takes 75 cold damage plus 6d8 necrotic... and then it's my turn!

Mooks hit you and then die. It's pretty hillarious.

Trick is that DMs avoid attacking you (not a bad thing of course). I'd like to try and find a way to force them to attack me.

I currently like the feel of a Conquest Paladin (they get AoA as a class spell + Compelled duel spell) with Sentinel feat, and 3 levels of Cavalier, and the rest in Favored Soul (higher level slots for AoA).

Champions challenge/ Sentinel/ Cavalier forces them to attack you. When they do, they regret it.

Garthanos · Jul 20, 2019

dnd4vr said:
For 5E? Do you want a tank?

I flagged 5e for a reason and No a D&D character

dnd4vr said:
What level? Someone who protects others directly or indirectly?

I would like them to be able to protect progressively better

dnd4vr said:
Any particular class or race? More information is required.

No particular race but I like humans generally and martial classes.... though my Aegis Swordmage doesnt look like its going to happen

Garthanos · Jul 20, 2019

Flamestrike said:
Vuman Cavalier Fighter [sentinel feat]. Use a halberd for reach.

From 1st level you have Sentinel (AoO if your target moves away (reducing their speed to 0) or attacks someone other than you).

From 3rd level you can 'mark' creatures you attack; they have disadvantage to attack anyone other than you, and if they damage anyone other than you, you get a free attack against them the following round (at advantage, with a slight damage buff, as a bonus action, a few times per day).

At 4th level, take PAM as your feat - you now also gain an AoO when creatures enter your reach.

At 7th level, you get a parry ability to protect yourself or adjacent creatures.

At 10th level, any movement in your reach provokes AoO (and reduces speed to 0).

At 18th level you get an AoO every single turn, allowing an AoO against every single creature that tries to move away from you, enter your reach, or attack anyone else but you.

For feats other than PAM and Sentinel the usual suspects look good. GWM for damage. HAM gives some nice DR. Martial Adept is useful for a Trip attack against a creature entering your reach (reduce speed to 0, trip them, they cant attack you, and then wail on them on your turn). Lucky and Resilient are great as always. Mounted Combat is fluffy but campaign dependent.

Otherwise boost Con, then Strength (and keep your eyes open for a Belt of Giant Strength).

If your DM uses UA and is a fool, take the Tunnel Fighter fighting style. Otherwise Defense style is good.

For MC options, give yourself a Charisma of at least 13 at character creation, and take 3 levels (or more) in Crown Paladin. You gain a 1/ Short rest lock down of all creatures within 30' (they cant move away from you) with your Divine Channel, and access to Compelled Duel as a spell (plus a few Smites).

Also very fluffy.

Cavalier is evidently one of the things I have been overlooking... protection style is one of those sounds nice but eats too much by taking your reaction against an attack that you do not even know is going to hit? And once you start fighting enemies with multiple attacks, your Reaction from the style only works on the first attack.

In 4e you could mark multiple opponents from level one using various abilities even when you weren't there to put the beat down and force the opening basically you could picture it as being scary intimidating enough to be a distraction