Greataxe, greatsword, and a little math

jaelis · Mar 29, 2018

FrogReaver said:
Moral of the story. Don't dig in after discounting someone else's suggestion with a criticism that applies just as easily to yours.

OK, that is not at all what I meant, I'm sorry if it came across that way.

Your suggestion makes sense, but it is true that there is no fixed bonus crit damage you can add that makes the two weapons balanced for all ACs. It is also true that if you make the base damage balanced, then it will be balanced also when crits are included. You could instead decide to make them balanced with crits for some nominal AC target, I don't think there is anything wrong with that idea. It is just not how I took your question.

TwoSix · Mar 29, 2018

I'm struggling to see how "I want the weapons to be balanced in all situations" and "I want to maintain the unique properties of each damage expression" aren't mutually exclusive. I mean, isn't the point of having unique properties specifically to cause variations in effectiveness in different situations?

Coroc · Mar 29, 2018

The more important Thing about These weapons which bothers me (being a grognard) is that both of these weapons look out of place / unesthetic/ unrealistic on every other race other than human halforc, dragonborn, and maybe halfelf.

Take that right into the face of diversity

jaelis · Mar 29, 2018

TwoSix said:
I'm struggling to see how "I want the weapons to be balanced in all situations" and "I want to maintain the unique properties of each damage expression" aren't mutually exclusive. I mean, isn't the point of having unique properties specifically to cause variations in effectiveness in different situations?

Well, I would argue that my suggestion achieves this, in the limited sense that the average damage is balanced while the damage spread remains quite different. On average, they are equally effective, but I'd say they would have a quite different feel.

jaelis · Mar 29, 2018

Coroc said:
The more important Thing about These weapons which bothers me (being a grognard) is that both of these weapons look out of place / unesthetic/ unrealistic on every other race other than human halforc, dragonborn, and maybe halfelf.

Take that right into the face of diversity

Not sure how the grognardism comes into it, since elves and dwarves in AD&D could use two-handed swords just fine

Coroc · Mar 29, 2018

[MENTION=60210]jaelis[/MENTION] Yea but it did look equally stupid on them back then so it was housruled away without big discussion

jaelis · Mar 29, 2018

Coroc said:
[MENTION=60210]jaelis[/MENTION] Yea but it did look equally stupid on them back then so it was housruled away without big discussion

Well, the same solution is still available

Not sure I agree though about a dwarf with a greataxe, FWIW

Coroc · Mar 29, 2018

[MENTION=60210]jaelis[/MENTION], ok dwarf with greataxe i give your that one, at least if you take those modern 4-5 ft dwarves with a broad build, but a flimsy elf with a maul? Cmon now stay true

Pauper · Mar 29, 2018

I think you'd have to specify a few things about the bonus damage die that would make it not really worth putting in:

- The bonus damage die does not itself allow you to roll another d12 if you get a max result on it.

Otherwise, you've just created an exploding damage weapon in D&D, which easily will become the most popular two-handed weapon in the game, regardless of 'average'; the chance to take down an adult red dragon on the first hit is just too nice an opportunity to pass up.

- Any additional dice rolled with the weapon (such as critical hit damage, bonus elemental or other damage such as from a flame tongue weapon, bonus damage from character abilities such as Divine Smite) do not get additional dice from max results.

Again, this is to prevent the greataxe from becoming the default two-handed weapon for paladins or in other situations where characters get to roll lots of damage dice.

Since you'd in effect be saying that you're rolling a single d12 in a specific circumstance (roll a '12' on the greataxe base damage die), I'm not sure the benefit is really worth the added trouble.

--
Pauper

jaelis · Mar 29, 2018

Pauper said:
I think you'd have to specify a few things about the bonus damage die that would make it not really worth putting in:

- The bonus damage die does not itself allow you to roll another d12 if you get a max result on it.

Otherwise, you've just created an exploding damage weapon in D&D, which easily will become the most popular two-handed weapon in the game, regardless of 'average'; the chance to take down an adult red dragon on the first hit is just too nice an opportunity to pass up.

- Any additional dice rolled with the weapon (such as critical hit damage, bonus elemental or other damage such as from a flame tongue weapon, bonus damage from character abilities such as Divine Smite) do not get additional dice from max results.

Again, this is to prevent the greataxe from becoming the default two-handed weapon for paladins or in other situations where characters get to roll lots of damage dice.

Since you'd in effect be saying that you're rolling a single d12 in a specific circumstance (roll a '12' on the greataxe base damage die), I'm not sure the benefit is really worth the added trouble.

Yes, you only get one reroll. I would allow a reroll on crit dice, just like a greatsword gets to reroll both d6s on a crit. Certainly it only applies to the actual weapon die.

As regards to whether it is worth it, it does make the two weapons more balanced. If the existing imbalance doesn't bother you, then you are probably just a little more sane than me, so I can't argue with that

Greataxe, greatsword, and a little math

jaelis

Oh this is where the title goes?

TwoSix

Dirty, realism-hating munchkin powergamer

Coroc

Hero

jaelis

Oh this is where the title goes?

jaelis

Oh this is where the title goes?

Coroc

Hero

jaelis

Oh this is where the title goes?

Coroc

Hero

Pauper

That guy, who does that thing.

jaelis

Oh this is where the title goes?

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