Racial ASI removal: ASI to Class and Background

In a future campaign, I'd like to try to remove the racial stat bonus and give it to class and background (ala 13th Age).
1) First, I'll come up with a list of bonus for class and background
2) I'll probably need something to give to basic humans (Prodigy or Skilled feats-equivalent?)

Class ASI
Barbarian: +1 Str, +1 Con
Bard: +1 Cha, +1 Int
Cleric: +1 Wis, +1 Cha
Druid: +1 Wis, +1 Con
Fighter: +1 Str, +1 Dex
Monk: +1 Wis, +1 Int
Paladin: +1 Cha, +1 Wis
Ranger: +1 Dex, +1 Con
Rogue: +1 Dex, +1 Int
Sorcerer: +1 Cha, +1 Con
Warlock: +1 Int, +1 Cha
Wizard: +1 Int, +1 Wis

Background ASI
Acolyte: +1 Wis or +1 Int
Charlatan: +1 Cha or +1 Int
Criminal: +1 Dex or +1 Cha
Entertainer: +1 Cha or +1 Dex
Folk Hero: +1 Con or +1 Wis
Gladiator: +1 Con or +1 Str
Guild Artisan: +1 Int or +1 Dex
Guild Merchant: +1 Cha or +1 Int
Hermit: +1 Wis or +1 Con
Knight: +1 Cha or +1 Str
Noble: +1 Cha or +1 Dex
Outlander: +1 Con or +1 Wis
Pirate: +1 Dex or +1 Cha
Sage: +1 Int or +1 Wis
Sailor: +1 Str or +1 Con
Soldier: +1 Con or +1 Str
Spy: +1 Int or +1 Dex
Urchin: +1 Con or +1 Dex

Background (SCAG) ASI
City Watch: +1 Str or +1 Wis
Clan Crafter: +1 Str or +1 Int
Cloistered Scholar: +1 Wis or +1 Int
Courtier: +1 Cha or +1 WIs
Faction Agent: +1 Int or +1 Cha
Far traveler: +1 Con or +1 Dex
Inheritor: +1 Wis or +1 Con
Investigator: +1 Int or +1 Wis
Knight of the Order: +1 Wis or +1 Cha
Mercenary Veteran: +1 Str or +1 Con
Urban Bounty Hunter: +1 Dex or +1 Cha
Uthgart Tribe Member: +1 Str or +1 Wis
Waterdhavian Noble: +1 Int or +1 Cha

Background (Other) ASI
Haunted One:+1 Wis or +1 Con
Archaeologist: +1 Dex or +1 Int
Anthropologist: +1 Cha or +1 Int

For now, the ASI are purely arbitrary and a simple reflection of how I see them. How would you do it? What would you give to the base human?

I'd just tie it to class (+2, +1). Otherwise you're going to do to background what is currently being done to race, that is, turning background choice into pure mechanical optimization. Right now I see people choosing background at least partly because of concept; I hate to abolish that completely.

Elfcrusher said:

I'd just tie it to class (+2, +1). Otherwise you're going to do to background what is currently being done to race, that is, turning background choice into pure mechanical optimization. Right now I see people choosing background at least partly because of concept; I hate to abolish that completely.

Click to expand...

I agree with this sentiment.

Elfcrusher said:

I'd just tie it to class (+2, +1). Otherwise you're going to do to background what is currently being done to race, that is, turning background choice into pure mechanical optimization. Right now I see people choosing background at least partly because of concept; I hate to abolish that completely.

Click to expand...

I can see that happening, true. What ASI (+2, +1) would you give to which class in this case?

I think linking them to class would be ok for the reasons others have mentioned, but I would be a bit cautious since it will just boost the ability scores that most players will have made good for their class, anyway. It might work, and I'd be curious to see how it comes out.

Since right now (with you using backgrounds) each class receives to ASI of +1, you could instead keep the third ASI +1 linked to race if you wanted. Just a thought.

I think it is interesting. As to objections about optimization...I think it is lame to ignore race and background RP and honk only of pluses and minuses. However, choosing natural pairings has been baked in for a long time. More importantly it allows for the fun of playing against type. But pragmatically, we should game with people with compatible styles.

If someone is not into roleplaying that is their style. Removing optimization choices won't change it really. They will just shoddily roleplay some other alternative IMHO.

That said, I am lazy and would not be likely to implement a new system as DM though I would play in such a campaign willingly.

vincegetorix said:

I can see that happening, true. What ASI (+2, +1) would you give to which class in this case?

Click to expand...

First take:

Barbarian (+2 Str, +1 Con - easy enough)
Bard (+2 Chr, +1 Dex - pretty simple but you could reasonably swap Dex for Int)
Cleric (+2 Wis, +1 Str - assuming the heavy armor-types anyway)
Druid (+2 Wis, +1 Con - hey, they are out in the harsh elements and tough)
Fighter (+2 Con, +1 Str - constant training makes them hardy and stronger, you could swap out Dex just as easily)
Monk (+2 Dex, +1 Wis - also makes sense to reverse if that is your take)
Paladin (+2 Str, +1 Wis - again for more "tanky" builds)
Ranger (+2 Dex, +1 Int - they are cunning, Wis also makes sense, but I am trying not to overload any one ability score)
Sorcerer (+2 Chr, +1 Con - their bodies channel their magic so they can take it)
Warlock (+2 Chr, +1 Int - knowledge of their link to other realms)
Wizard (+2 Int, +1 Dex - they have complex somantic components and helps a bit against squishiness)

As presented (no swapping), every ability score gets 6 points of boost when you combine all the classes so it is even in that respect and won't favor any ability over another.

Unfortunately, in 5E Charisma is over-weighted. Paladin's needing it for their spells would indicate a Chr +1 would be nice, but then Wis is under-valued. Just depends on how much a balance is important to you and your game (I'm a Libra-- it is very important to me as long as I can justify it LOL!)

Elfcrusher said:

I'd just tie it to class (+2, +1). Otherwise you're going to do to background what is currently being done to race, that is, turning background choice into pure mechanical optimization. Right now I see people choosing background at least partly because of concept; I hate to abolish that completely.

Click to expand...

There is a sweet spot where choices are beneficial while not having too great an impact. ASI's simply have far to great an impact and so having anything explicitly grant them becomes too much.

That said, my solution would be:

Neither race nor background gives Ability Score Increases.
Instead a PC gets a ability score bonuses that he chooses but is restricted by race and background. Each race has 2 ability scores that a PC could choose to increase. Each background has 1-2 as well. The PC gets to place a +2 in one of those ability scores and a +1 in another one of those ability scores. (Humans may be a little different).

This frees up race and background choice a lot more but still makes the choices have an impact but not too great an impact.

If I were to do class ASIs I would probably connect a point to subclass. As it is you are re-enforcing specific subclass choices because the first round of bonuses don't build towards some of the MAD subclasses. Inquisitives, Valor Bards, Sword Bards, etc shouldn't be pushed aside because of class choice.

Elfcrusher said:

I'd just tie it to class (+2, +1). Otherwise you're going to do to background what is currently being done to race, that is, turning background choice into pure mechanical optimization. Right now I see people choosing background at least partly because of concept; I hate to abolish that completely.

Click to expand...

I wouldn't tie it to background simply because the backgrounds are written to be completely fungible - suggestions to be customized as the player sees fit - and I like it that way.

So, [MENTION=6871653]vincegetorix[/MENTION], I'd go with what you have for the classes (+1 in two different attributes) and a floating +1 the player can place anywhere they want.