Sneak Peek At Ghosts of Saltmarsh Maps

Here's a sneak peek at some of the maps to be found in the upcoming D&D Ghosts of Saltmarsh, courtesy of WotC's Twitch stream.


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And Dyson Logos, one of the cartographers for the book, has shared some of his work which will be appearing!



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D1WNe3NWoAIjD-j.jpg
 

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Hussar

Legend
I wonder if this is related to groups that don't do a lot of mapping during play. Left, right, ahead, (never minding, Top and Bottom) would be incredibly frustrating to the mapper.

But, as [MENTION=6796661]MNblockhead[/MENTION] says, maybe it's just an experience thing. My group also has a fair bit of military background, so it seems pretty natural to put north at the top of the map.

Heh. Right as I type this, I'm looking at the weather map for today on TV. Funnily enough, it's oriented north to the top. :D Every time I use Google Maps, it's oriented north to the top. Every single map of Canada I've ever seen, going back centuries, is oriented north to the top.

North to the top has been the standard for centuries now. It's pretty ubiquitous.

Heck, rolling this back around to Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh, the town in the three modules was never mapped. It's not like there's any sort of canon or tradition here. You were instructed by the original module to make your own map. So, why make a map that it automatically harder to use at the table?

Player: Where is the general store?
DM: It's in the west end of the town, next to the Color Animal Inn.
Player: Huh? The Color Animal Inn is in the North isn't it?
DM: Oh, right. North end of the map.

Wash, rinse, repeat. Yuck.
 

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Parmandur

Book-Friend
I wonder if this is related to groups that don't do a lot of mapping during play. Left, right, ahead, (never minding, Top and Bottom) would be incredibly frustrating to the mapper.

But, as [MENTION=6796661]MNblockhead[/MENTION] says, maybe it's just an experience thing. My group also has a fair bit of military background, so it seems pretty natural to put north at the top of the map.

Heh. Right as I type this, I'm looking at the weather map for today on TV. Funnily enough, it's oriented north to the top. :D Every time I use Google Maps, it's oriented north to the top. Every single map of Canada I've ever seen, going back centuries, is oriented north to the top.

North to the top has been the standard for centuries now. It's pretty ubiquitous.

Heck, rolling this back around to Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh, the town in the three modules was never mapped. It's not like there's any sort of canon or tradition here. You were instructed by the original module to make your own map. So, why make a map that it automatically harder to use at the table?

Player: Where is the general store?
DM: It's in the west end of the town, next to the Color Animal Inn.
Player: Huh? The Color Animal Inn is in the North isn't it?
DM: Oh, right. North end of the map.

Wash, rinse, repeat. Yuck.

Actually, it was mapped in the 3.5 DMG2, which this map is based off: dunno what the orientation there was.

Google Maps is oriented so that the top is the direction my car is moving by default, not by North. And I have seen many, many maps on atlases using alternate set-ups.
 


MNblockhead

A Title Much Cooler Than Anything on the Old Site
Actually, it was mapped in the 3.5 DMG2, which this map is based off: dunno what the orientation there was.

Google Maps is oriented so that the top is the direction my car is moving by default, not by North. And I have seen many, many maps on atlases using alternate set-ups.

That is only when you are in navigation mode. If you are simply searching for a location or directions from point A to B, the orientation of Google Maps is always the same in Satellite and Map modes. North is on the top of your screen, and south is on the bottom.

While North at top may be "new" when looking across history, it is safe to say the that for pretty much everyone living today, the vast majority of maps they have seen put north at top to point that this is expected. Will increasing use of mobile navigation devices and apps change this? Maybe. But if you are dealing with a static image on print or in a VTT, it behooves the creators to use N-at-top orientation to increase ease of use for most customers.
 

WaterRabbit

Explorer
But if you are dealing with a static image on print or in a VTT, it behooves the creators to use N-at-top orientation to increase ease of use for most customers.

Disagree. I behooves the creators to make the most effective presentation not necessarily bowing to blind convention. Maybe those of us that grew up with print being the most common medium don't really see this as an issue since changing the orientation of a map is trivial (just rotate the page). Maybe for those who grew up in the digital it seems a much bigger deal since it is more difficult to rotate an image (like two mouse clicks depending on the view software).
 

Hussar

Legend
Disagree. I behooves the creators to make the most effective presentation not necessarily bowing to blind convention. Maybe those of us that grew up with print being the most common medium don't really see this as an issue since changing the orientation of a map is trivial (just rotate the page). Maybe for those who grew up in the digital it seems a much bigger deal since it is more difficult to rotate an image (like two mouse clicks depending on the view software).

So, you have to rotate your 200 page (ish) book every time you want to use a map properly and that's "bowing to blind convention"?

Again, NEARLY EVERY print map you've ever used in your entire life has put north on the top of the map. And, note, sure, I can just reorient the map, but, in the print product, that's a bit more difficult.

You must not use a lot of 45 degree bends if you only give directions like left and right.

DM: The corridor T's ahead of you, left and right.

Player: So, East and West?

DM: No, remember, North is to the left of your map.

Player, Ok, so, North and South.

DM: No, it's not quite a right turn. It's a soft turn in each direction.

Player: So, Northwest... or, sorry, right, north is to the left, so, northeast and southeast?

DM: Yes, that's right.

Player: Ok, we head down the northwe... I mean northea... I mean left corridor.

Again, no thanks. Draw the map properly in the first place and there's no problem. You can call it "blind convention" all you like, but, well, it's been that way for about five hundred years. At that point, it's not just convention, it's how it's supposed to be done. And, it's done that way so that everyone who looks at the map immediately knows how to orient it, even maps without a compass rose on them. My paper provincial map of Ontario doesn't have a compass rose on it, yet, I automatically know how to orient the map. My google map searches automatically orient north to the top, so, that I don't have to hunt down which way that map is oriented. I can assume, because maps are drawn north to the top, that north is, in fact, on the top of the map.

There's a word for "blind convention" that I'm not sure you're aware of. It's called standardization. Heck, a meter is just a "blind convention" too, and so is a yard or a pound or a kilogram or virtually any other measurement. Yet, funnily enough, a kilogram is the same everywhere in the world.

I guess we should not follow standards and have to learn new ones every time. :erm:

-------- Edit to add

Oh, yeah, let's not forget, when we rotate the map 90 degrees, all the text on the map rotates as well. Meaning that the map now looks like crap because everything written on the map is oriented wrong. So much for all that work making a beautiful map. In actual use, your map looks bad and everyone reading your map is cocking their head to one side, looking like a confused Labrador.

Draw it right the first time and all these problems go away.
 
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If you want to be realistic in your descriptions, then you have to assume that the characters will generally have no idea which direction north is, so directions should be described relative to the current facing. This is what most sat nav aps do - they put the current direction of travel at the top of the map, not north. Even before smartphones, most people rotated road maps to put "ahead" at the top. If you ask for directions around a town, people will give directions in terms of street names, left and right and major landmarks (pubs, mostly). They make no mention of compass points.

If you are navigating in the wilderness or at sea, then you will need to use bearings. Compass points simply aren't precise enough.

Oh, and which direction would you consider "correct" for the galaxy map in a science fiction RPG?

"Second star to the right, and straight on till morning."
- Peter Pan/Star Trek
 

sim-h

Explorer
If you want to be realistic in your descriptions, then you have to assume that the characters will generally have no idea which direction north is

I'd say the opposite is true. Sun rises in the east and sets in the west (or equivalent, in any homebrew world). Because of that, you have a general idea which way is north, even in unfamiliar locations.

If you've been somewhere for a day or even a few hours, you know for sure which way is north.

Maps are easier to use if north is at the top. I don't see it as a horrendous issue - but certainly an irritation.
 

Go up to someone in the street and ask them which way north is then! I bet they either won't be able to tell you or take several minutes to work it out.

"The direction the Sun rises" isn't very helpful to anyone who lives in a town (or a long way north or south of the equator).
 
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Parmandur

Book-Friend
Go up to someone in the street and ask them which way north is then! I bet they either won't be able to tell you or take several minutes to work it out.

"The direction the Sun rises" isn't very helpful to anyone who lives in a town (or a long way north or south of the equator).

Someone in the street in 21st century America or Europe, maybe; somebody on the street in a Medieval world, they know where North is. Rangers, Barbarians, Druids, Wizards, Clerics, etc. will know the cardinal directions for sure, and really anybody in a society like that.
 

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