2 Questions: New Edition and Class Comparison

GoodKingJayIII

First Post
I currently play a Tech Specialist in a friend's game, and for a while now I've seriously debated buying the Revised SW d20 book. With the introduction of 3.5, is it likely that another Revised book will be out soon? I'd hate to purchase something and have it go out of date 3 months later.

Also, with all the "Sell me on Star Wars" threads I've seen lately, I thought I'd ask a little bit about class balance. More specifically, how do the classes match up against one another in combat/non-combat roles. How do the Jedi classes match up against one another? Is the Force Adept a viable choice for 20 levels, or is it just a springboard for the Jedi class? I haven't seen a lot of specific discussion about the classes, so I thought I'd ask some of the experienced players/DMs and see what they'd experienced. Thanks!
 

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Psion

Adventurer
There is already a second printing of the RCRB which includes some errata.

As for another book, rumor has it that WotC agreed to a publication with each major movie release. Whether that publication will be a core rulebook (or whether the rumor holds in substance) remains in question.
 

Regarding new editions and so on: what Psion said.

I'm the GM of a fairly long-running SW campaign, so I've had many opportunity to compare classes in various situations. My PCs are a Jedi Guardian, a Noble/Force Adept, a Scoundrel, and a Soldier/Starfighter Ace.

Scout: We haven't had one of these, but it looks like a fair balance between combat and non-combat roles, though I'm a bit doubtful about the usefulness of Extreme Effort and Heart.
Soldier: Powerful, flexible combat class, the best choice for pilots. Can be a bit one-dimensional and out of their depth in social situations especially. A good choice all the way to 20th, though many players might prefer to specialise with a PrC - with the rarity of ranged-combat feats, soldiers can be pushed into being melee-monsters by default.
Noble: Great in a campaign with lots of social encounters (despite missing Bluff and Gather Info as class skills), and occasionally useful elsewhere. High-level Favour checks, etc can be a real GM headache. The noble in our game saved everyone's butt with a well-chosen Favour check last session. Weak in combat. Multiclassing might be useful, to give them some more options - taking Soldier (the pilot route) or Force Adept could be worthwhile.
Fringer: Can't comment on this one, since nobody's been tempted by them in my campaign.
Force Adept: Our FA has proven very capable in combat (especially with the Force techniques from the Hero's Guide) after a shaky start. Good selection of skills and a couple of neat abilities make it a varied, interesting and flexible class, all the way through. Also good for multiclassing, since once you've got Control, Sense and Alter, you can go back to another class and still keep improving your Force powers with skill points from Scoundrel or Scout or whatever. Some of the high-level abilities may be too tempting to give up though.
Scoundrel: Very good class, will tend to be your skill specialist. The Precise Attack and Lucky class abilities, plus the bonus feats, can make them surprisingly effective combatants. Very high-level Scoundrels with high Int can really start to break the skill DC system. Taking a level or two of Scoundrel as a multiclass can be tempting for anyone, just to beef up their skills a bit.
Tech Spec: Very weak, both in and out of combat. Doesn't even have blaster pistol proficiency. The player of our Scoundrel PC originally considered one of these, but eventually decided that the extra skill points of the Scoundrel let him do the techie character concept better than Tech Spec did - kind of a sad state of affairs.
Jedi Guardian: They don't get any better in melee than this. A cleverly built JG can be an absolute untouchable juggernaut. Tends to be one-dimensional though, cos they have to spend so many of their limited skill points on force powers.
Jedi Consular: Trades a bit of the offensive power of the JG for some extra skills, but many of the same comments apply.

Bear in mind, though, because of the way in which BABs quickly outstrip Defense bonuses and the fact that any shmuck can get their hands on a 3d8 weapon with minimal effort means that the difference between combat characters and non-combat characters is actually not that big. Jedi are the massive exception though.
 

mojo1701

First Post
humble minion said:
Regarding new editions and so on: what Psion said.

Fringer: Can't comment on this one, since nobody's been tempted by them in my campaign.

Yeah, it really isn't a big draw, unless you're playing a campaign based on backwater worlds, but even then...
 

Davelozzi

Explorer
Psion said:
As for another book, rumor has it that WotC agreed to a publication with each major movie release. Whether that publication will be a core rulebook (or whether the rumor holds in substance) remains in question.

I'm fairly sure that I recently saw a quote from someone on the Star Wars team at WotC that they would be issuing an episode 3 sourcebook but not revising the core book. From what I've heard, that was the plan last time too but there was so many people screaming about things that needed to be fixed that they decided to do it as a revision instead.

Unfortunately, I don't remember exactly who said it and can't provide a link.
 

argo

First Post
I played in a year-long SW (revised) campagin last year, here is what I observed. One thing to note is that a lot of classes tend to revolve around special ability progressions which tend to come about every 4th or 5th level. This then tends to make multiclassing less tempting, except for Soldier and Scoundrel, you can always benefit from two levels of either.

Scout: The fact that the class stradles the line between combat and skills is atractive as it solves the multiclassing problem (see my comments above). However, unless your campagin is "Desert Raiders of Tantoonie" (not unherd of in SW) then there is a _very_ good chance that many of your class abilities will go to waste. Also, Heart and Extreme Effort do indeed suck.

Soldier: This is the fighter tweaked out for SW. What more is there to say? If you want to use the full range of SW weapons this class is your best choice, it also gives you enough feats to tweak out your ranged combat style and still pick up a few sidelines (defensive martial arts anyyone?). Also a good way to become a pilot. The big problem with this class is not with the class but with a few (IMHO) flaws in SW combat. Armor is nearly useless in SW which negates one of the Soldiers advantages, also big guns do not have enough of an advantage over pistols to really put the soldier ahead of the other classes. If you play a Soldier beg your DM to use the Arms and Equipment Guide and to consider taking a few ranged combat feats from d20 Modern.

Noble: They did so well in designing this class and yet still missed the mark. This class excells in social situations but the Scoundrel is close enough in that arena to make you wonder if the lack of combat ability is worth it. The revised edition made Favor a workable, powerful, and cool ability. This is a class which tempts you to multiclass out for a few levels but it is also one that can be hurt most by that (you want levels to acces Favor and wealth checks).

Fringer: In much the same boat as the Scout and for the same reasons. Unless you are playing Junkyard (Star) Wars then you run the risk of not getting the most out of your abilities. Makes an awsome pilot though.

Force Adept: If there aren't any Jedi around then this class will rock combat. Is a little more flexible than Jedi both ability wise and morally (thus ignoring the theory you aren't supposed to balance classes based on RP elements, the Jedi classes themselves do this as well). This is a good class though I am not sure if it can hold a persons interest for a full 20 levels. unlike the Jedi classes the Force Adept is prety multiclass friendly and thus might be your best bet if you want a multiclass force user.

Scoundrel: May very well be the best non-force using class in the game. Skills are very useful in SW but Precise Attack, Luck, and the bonus feats really add up. No wonder Han Solo kicked so much stormtrooper but! A 3/4 BAB is not all that bad when you have those other benies, being a little weak on HP is this classes only real problem.

Tech Spec: I played a Tech Spec so believe me when I tell you that it is the weakest class in the game. That wouldn't be quite so frustrating if it wern't for the fact that 1) the scoundrel can everything you do, as well as you do it, plus more. 2) what special abilities the class does get are great for NPC's but prety bland fo a heroic PC. Want to be the galaxy's greatest surgeon? No problem; except for med droids and Jedi with healing abilities that is, oh and Bacta tanks, dont forget those. Want to build one type of masterwork item (but only one type)? Can do! Yeah, being a Tech Spec is depressing.

Jedi Guardian: This guy is so good at meele he practically obliterates teh line between meele and ranged combat altogether. The only limit on this class is that the need to keep pumping skills into force abilities can leave him a little wanting of other skills. Except that some Force abilities can help there too! Sigh.

Jedi Consular: Not quite so good at light saber-fu as the Guardian but still as good a combat machine as the best of the other classes. The Added force powers are just icing on the cake.

In general the Jedi classes are far and away best classes in the game, not at all balanced. But, that really is as it should be, SW just wouldn't be SW if a Jedi couldn't kick the stuffing out of anybody else his level. This is one reason why many DM's will allow a party of all Jedi, one Jedi, or no Jedi. Any of those should be a workable combination but a party of half Jedi and half not is potentially troublesome. Still, a good DM should be able handle it, especially considering all the trouble that Dark Side Points can cause for force users. The Noble, Scout, and Fringer need some help when out of their respective elements. The Tech Spec needs to be re-built from the ground up. The Soldier and Scoundrel should do ok anywhere, even when in the company of Jedi.

Hope that helps!
 

Lord Pendragon

First Post
argo said:
The Soldier and Scoundrel should do ok anywhere, even when in the company of Jedi.
I just want to quickly agree with this. I'm playing in a young SW campaign, with all Jedi...except for one soldier. The player likes to ham it up about how he's "in the presence of great Jedi" and that he's not worthy, etc. etc. But when the you-know-what hits the fan, he dual-wields blasters and hits very, very hard.
 

EdwardForrester

First Post
According to a different website, swrpgnetwork.com (great SW site by the way), the head guy there Mordid said that he was at Gen Con when the head SW guy said no to another revision when Episode 3 gets here. But that a source book would come
 

GoodKingJayIII

First Post
In general the Jedi classes are far and away best classes in the game, not at all balanced. But, that really is as it should be, SW just wouldn't be SW if a Jedi couldn't kick the stuffing out of anybody else his level.

This is actually the first time I've seen this on the message boards before. Quite a few people have said that the Jedi Guardian excels in melee, but will get eaten alive by large amounts of blaster fire. I was under the impression that SW d20 has a group dynamic very similar to DnD: classes excel in certain situations, and where they fall short, someone else backs them up.

I just want to quickly agree with this. I'm playing in a young SW campaign, with all Jedi...except for one soldier. The player likes to ham it up about how he's "in the presence of great Jedi" and that he's not worthy, etc. etc. But when the you-know-what hits the fan, he dual-wields blasters and hits very, very hard.

I would expect nothing less from the SW equivalent of a fighter. I've heard that they really tear things apart in ranged combat. A few people have mentioned soldiers (and other classes) "saving the Jedi's butt" a few times as well.
 

d4

First Post
EdwardForrester said:
According to a different website, swrpgnetwork.com (great SW site by the way), the head guy there Mordid said that he was at Gen Con when the head SW guy said no to another revision when Episode 3 gets here. But that a source book would come
considering that Moridin is one of the freelancers currently writing for Star Wars d20, i think it's safe to trust him. :)
 
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