D&D General Beast Master Ranger Should Have A Familiar

[doctorbadwolf]

I have no problem with any of that. By modern, I mean some poor, soulless creature, that the caster just resurrects constantly to do its bidding. It should be able to die, not just be resurrected after a long rest to suffer in pain again because the caster needs it in a fight or to travel down a hallway to trigger traps.
The way it is set up right now, there is no role-playing difference between summon creatures or having a familiar. If you have a pet, your character should treat the pet similar to how their alignment treats the pet. And if it dies, maybe wait a few levels before getting another one. Maybe the PC has to wait until the next tier?

Multiple levels is a complete nonstarter without a huge boost or simply making familairs completely balance neutral and extremely low-impact.

If you want that, use sidekicks.

A thing that can be your subclass simply cannot be taken away for multiple levels. That is insanely bad design.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

RIP Kodo

View attachment 447454

Thing is, Dar’s world is light on fireballs.

If you want an an animal to be a character, then they need the same plot armour as the PCs have. They also need someone to play them. The only thing preventing most familiars having a personality is the faff of trying to play multiple characters. The imp in the Warlock demo manages to establish a personality in just a few minutes. Shovel in BG3 has a personality when most familiars don’t. It’s just a matter of putting the effort in.

 

[Minigiant]

Familiars are both. The line between the two doesnt exist.

It does.

In my model, you need a charmed or friendly beast to create the end creature.

Conjuration vs Enchantment vs Transmutation

 

[doctorbadwolf]

It does.

In my model, you need a charmed or friendly beast to create the end creature.

Conjuration vs Enchantment vs Transmutation

Your model isnt how the game works nor how the lore works, though. It is a potentially interesting idea for a new world, but it isnt how dnd works, and the real world lore of witches and familiars features both otherwordly spirits and "normal" animals and doesnt really distinguish between them.

 

[Scott Christian]

Multiple levels is a complete nonstarter without a huge boost or simply making familairs completely balance neutral and extremely low-impact.

If you want that, use sidekicks.

A thing that can be your subclass simply cannot be taken away for multiple levels. That is insanely bad design.

I know it is a non-starter for most, because most people only care that their familiar can do things that help them in combat or exploration. That is literally what I am talking about. Players not wanting any emotional attachment to their familiar.

It’s just a matter of putting the effort in.

It is not just a matter of putting in effort in order to make players care about their familiar. When their familiar is only there during the most opportune times, then disappears or dies with zero consequence, it becomes an item, not a character. Even if you give it a personality.
The familiar was killed by the nasty demon. There is no funeral or grieving. It's, "That's ok. I will summon them back tomorrow (or that same day), so they can die again. But at least I got advantage on that attack roll." The familiar becomes a piece of equipment that just goes in the bag, and then it comes out when needed.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

When their familiar is only there during the most opportune times, then disappears or dies with zero consequence, it becomes an item, not a character

Player characters don’t have to die for the players to care about them. That’s why they have plot armour. They just need to have some attention paid to them. Without plot armour the familiar is going to die every episode. Which means it either gets an identical replacement the same as a PC, or, if it has -1 con like 1st edition, it’s too big a liability and no one has one.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I know it is a non-starter for most, because most people only care that their familiar can do things that help them in combat or exploration. That is literally what I am talking about. Players not wanting any emotional attachment to their familiar.

It is a non starter for players that are attached to their familiar. It is just bad gameplay.

It is not just a matter of putting in effort in order to make players care about their familiar. When their familiar is only there during the most opportune times, then disappears or dies with zero consequence, it becomes an item, not a character. Even if you give it a personality.
The familiar was killed by the nasty demon. There is no funeral or grieving. It's, "That's ok. I will summon them back tomorrow (or that same day), so they can die again. But at least I got advantage on that attack roll." The familiar becomes a piece of equipment that just goes in the bag, and then it comes out when needed.

The only way around that player problem without creating terrible gameplay is to either get rid of familiars, make them completely cosmetic, or make them tough enough that they arent going to die when taken adventuring.

And most of the game exists in exploration and combat. Even if the pillars were balanced that would be 2/3 of the game.

The other way to help with the issue is to give familiars things to do outside of combat and exploration, which requires changing the game to make things like spellcraft, alchemy, ritual magic, etc, require skill checks and benefit from a familiar. That will make it worth having a familiar regardless of taking it into dangerous situations, but it wont change that most games dont go back and forth between "camp" and "the dungeon", which means that familiar will still be with the wizard when she is hurling magic at things trying to kill her. Which means the familiar will still die sometimes, in most games.

 

[Mistwell]

Reading the familiar feats in Arcana Unleashed, i keep thinking about Rangers and how this is the sort of thing i wanted from the Ranger's animal companion.

Take the primal companions, and make them like the extra options for the chain pact warlock, as additional options for find familiar which should be a ranger spell to begin with.

BMs should get FF as always prepared, and be able to cast it a couple times per long rest for free, with extra options, and the familiar can attack.

The details could go several ways from there, but that would make such a better subclass with such better gameplay.

Thoughts?

Yeah I am with you. They should get Find Familiar automatically. Maybe even similar to the Pact of the Chain.

 

[Scott Christian]

Player characters don’t have to die for the players to care about them. That’s why they have plot armour. They just need to have some attention paid to them. Without plot armour the familiar is going to die every episode. Which means it either gets an identical replacement the same as a PC, or, if it has -1 con like 1st edition, it’s too big a liability and no one has one.

We can agree players care about items, right?

Because they care about something, such as, "I really like my +2 sword," doesn't make it a character.

I get what you are saying, and I think you are partially right. But, I also think you are simplifying the nuance of caring for a character at the table it too much.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Yeah I am with you. They should get Find Familiar automatically. Maybe even similar to the Pact of the Chain.

Yep.