keterys
First Post
4E has been out for a little bit, so here are the major rule changes that have occurred to me. I'm not sure which (if any) of these I'll adopt, but I'll make this post and my players can let me know if they want to adopt any.
1. 'Charging requires that you move at least 1 square from your starting square instead of 2 squares'
Why: When only allowed a standard action (because of daze or having to stand up from prone), you may attack if you are 0 squares or 2+ squares away, but not when at exactly 1 square. Abilities which push several squares and knockdown are often optimal when they leave a target exactly 1 away. Again, non-intuitive and exploitable.
2. Remove the existing minion rule, change to
'Minion Weakness
If a minion is hit for any damage, it dies. If a minion takes damage without being hit, it is not killed, but it becomes bloodied and dies the next time it takes any damage in any way.'
So, automatic damage (auras, ongoing, damage shields, etc) would bloody then kill minions, damage on miss abilities (like dailies, hammer rhythm, reaping strike, etc) would bloody then kill, etc.
Why: Because it feels unfair and unrealistic to players for their half damage or damage on miss abilities to never work on minions, while it feels cheap or too easy for automatic damage effects to kill them. Plus it allows minions to live in the "bloodied" design space with everyone else.
3. Daily Item Usage tracking
Replace the usual Daily power limitations on items with
'Using a daily item power prevents the use of any daily or encounter powers from any item in that slot until you take an extended rest.' and
'Using an encounter item power prevents the use of any daily or encounters from any item in that slot until you take a short rest.'
Example: A level 4 character with a Frost weapon, Dwarven Plate, and a Cloak of Resistance can usually use 1 of their dailies, plus an additional 1 at each milestone. Under these rules, they could use all 3 of them, but they could not acquire additional dwarven suits of armor to swap into for extra healing surges.
Why: Mostly for player sanity. Preventing someone from carrying a dozen suits of dwarven armor in a bag to get extra surges is good, but making people track the powers is somewhat annoying and can lead to players favoring passive equipment bonuses rather than more interesting power uses.
4. Daze or stun can become "no fun", at least on important creatures:
PCs, Elite, and Solo creatures may remove a stun or daze effect at any time by spending an action point. If any of these creatures is dazed or stunned at the end of its turn after making any saves, it may choose to become Immune to the appropriate condition for the encounter in exchange for acquiring a vulnerability 5 (10 at paragon, 15 at epic) to any attack that carries the condition.
Example: Orcus is stunned for a round by Prismatic Spray and fails his save. He chooses to become Immune to stun, ending the condition, but gaining Vulnerability 15 to any attack that stuns. If he is hit by a Stunning Smite later in the encounter, he takes 15 additional damage but ignores the stun effect.
Why: Everyone is there to play the game - if you can't act, you're not really playing. If you can "stun lock" a solo, you're barely playing (and it's a lot easier at high levels than you might think). The vulnerability still rewards using those attack types so that it's not a pure nerf and more just a protection against boredom.
5. Power Exchange:
You may trade in a daily attack power for an encounter power of equal or lower level. You may trade in an encounter attack power for an at-will. You may still only know a power once, even if you have multiple powers of that level. You may freely revert this change at any time (such as when you want to trade in the daily for one of higher level).
Example: A level 9 elf rogue usually has 2 at-wills, 3 encounters of levels 1,3, and 7, and 3 dailies of levels 1, 5, and 9. He desperately wants a 3rd at-will so trades his level 1 encounter power to get it. He also doesn't like any of the 5th level rogue dailies, so trades it for a 2nd level 3 encounter power. He can't take the same power twice, however.
Why: Allows greater diversity of actions without requiring extended rests. It's more predictable power, so that's fine from a DM perspective, while providing comfort for a player. While the 3rd at-will might be considered to impinge on the human's territory, losing an encounter or daily to get it is a notable cost and it allows people to play a class that they feel uncomfortable with less than 3 at-wills without _having_ to be a human. And human wizards can get 4 at-wills, if they're really interested.
6. Milestones and extended rest:
'After an extended rest, you lose all action points.'
'After almost every encounter, you gain an action point. Particularly easy encounters or ones which burn little to no resources will not qualify as a milestone for this purpose.'
For daily item powers, treat the same as action points above (starting with 0 and gaining one per encounter)
Why: Mostly to reward doing more encounters and make taking an extended rest less rewarding and the first encounter less alpha strike capable. Assuming the group is doing at least three encounters a day it should work in their favor, though.
While obviously some of these won't work for others, feel free to give me any constructive feedback. Especially if any seem downright broken or would be perfect with some minor tweak. I tried to make each have a bit of give and take, so that it was a real choice and not just "And this works less well" and "this is just cooler", but I may have completely missed. Let me know.
1. 'Charging requires that you move at least 1 square from your starting square instead of 2 squares'
Why: When only allowed a standard action (because of daze or having to stand up from prone), you may attack if you are 0 squares or 2+ squares away, but not when at exactly 1 square. Abilities which push several squares and knockdown are often optimal when they leave a target exactly 1 away. Again, non-intuitive and exploitable.
2. Remove the existing minion rule, change to
'Minion Weakness
If a minion is hit for any damage, it dies. If a minion takes damage without being hit, it is not killed, but it becomes bloodied and dies the next time it takes any damage in any way.'
So, automatic damage (auras, ongoing, damage shields, etc) would bloody then kill minions, damage on miss abilities (like dailies, hammer rhythm, reaping strike, etc) would bloody then kill, etc.
Why: Because it feels unfair and unrealistic to players for their half damage or damage on miss abilities to never work on minions, while it feels cheap or too easy for automatic damage effects to kill them. Plus it allows minions to live in the "bloodied" design space with everyone else.
3. Daily Item Usage tracking
Replace the usual Daily power limitations on items with
'Using a daily item power prevents the use of any daily or encounter powers from any item in that slot until you take an extended rest.' and
'Using an encounter item power prevents the use of any daily or encounters from any item in that slot until you take a short rest.'
Example: A level 4 character with a Frost weapon, Dwarven Plate, and a Cloak of Resistance can usually use 1 of their dailies, plus an additional 1 at each milestone. Under these rules, they could use all 3 of them, but they could not acquire additional dwarven suits of armor to swap into for extra healing surges.
Why: Mostly for player sanity. Preventing someone from carrying a dozen suits of dwarven armor in a bag to get extra surges is good, but making people track the powers is somewhat annoying and can lead to players favoring passive equipment bonuses rather than more interesting power uses.
4. Daze or stun can become "no fun", at least on important creatures:
PCs, Elite, and Solo creatures may remove a stun or daze effect at any time by spending an action point. If any of these creatures is dazed or stunned at the end of its turn after making any saves, it may choose to become Immune to the appropriate condition for the encounter in exchange for acquiring a vulnerability 5 (10 at paragon, 15 at epic) to any attack that carries the condition.
Example: Orcus is stunned for a round by Prismatic Spray and fails his save. He chooses to become Immune to stun, ending the condition, but gaining Vulnerability 15 to any attack that stuns. If he is hit by a Stunning Smite later in the encounter, he takes 15 additional damage but ignores the stun effect.
Why: Everyone is there to play the game - if you can't act, you're not really playing. If you can "stun lock" a solo, you're barely playing (and it's a lot easier at high levels than you might think). The vulnerability still rewards using those attack types so that it's not a pure nerf and more just a protection against boredom.
5. Power Exchange:
You may trade in a daily attack power for an encounter power of equal or lower level. You may trade in an encounter attack power for an at-will. You may still only know a power once, even if you have multiple powers of that level. You may freely revert this change at any time (such as when you want to trade in the daily for one of higher level).
Example: A level 9 elf rogue usually has 2 at-wills, 3 encounters of levels 1,3, and 7, and 3 dailies of levels 1, 5, and 9. He desperately wants a 3rd at-will so trades his level 1 encounter power to get it. He also doesn't like any of the 5th level rogue dailies, so trades it for a 2nd level 3 encounter power. He can't take the same power twice, however.
Why: Allows greater diversity of actions without requiring extended rests. It's more predictable power, so that's fine from a DM perspective, while providing comfort for a player. While the 3rd at-will might be considered to impinge on the human's territory, losing an encounter or daily to get it is a notable cost and it allows people to play a class that they feel uncomfortable with less than 3 at-wills without _having_ to be a human. And human wizards can get 4 at-wills, if they're really interested.
6. Milestones and extended rest:
'After an extended rest, you lose all action points.'
'After almost every encounter, you gain an action point. Particularly easy encounters or ones which burn little to no resources will not qualify as a milestone for this purpose.'
For daily item powers, treat the same as action points above (starting with 0 and gaining one per encounter)
Why: Mostly to reward doing more encounters and make taking an extended rest less rewarding and the first encounter less alpha strike capable. Assuming the group is doing at least three encounters a day it should work in their favor, though.
While obviously some of these won't work for others, feel free to give me any constructive feedback. Especially if any seem downright broken or would be perfect with some minor tweak. I tried to make each have a bit of give and take, so that it was a real choice and not just "And this works less well" and "this is just cooler", but I may have completely missed. Let me know.
Last edited:
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