Critique Brawler Class

[Balgus]

I wanted a class like the monk's but not restricted by the lawful criteria. i wanted a class that can fight and take hits. I call it Brawler, but lately, Streetfighter, Alleycat.

Skills 4+int (skill list- like monk)
Int bonus to AC (like monk's wis)
Monk's saves, HD, Ac bonus, flurry of blows, BAB, speed bonus
1-Stunning Fist (use str instead of wis), flurry of blows, unarmed strike
2-Circle kick, evasion
3-still mind
4-uncanny dodge(cant lose dex), slow fall
5-Purity of Body
6-Bonus Feat, slow fall
7-Wholeness of body
8-slow fall, uncanny dodge (cant be flanked)
9-improved evasion
10-Mettle, slow fall
11-Diamond Body, greater flurry
12-Defensive roll, slow fall
13-diamond soul
14-slow fall
15-Quivering palm
16-Slow fall, Blindsight (5ft)
17-Acrobatic attack
18-slow fall
19-Empty Body
20-Perfect self

ABILITY

Mettle DOTF- templar. If you are allowed a WIL/Fort save for partial, you take none if you make the save. Failed save takes full damage

Defensive Roll PHB-rogue. On any melee attack, you can make a ref save (DC=damage taken). Made save takes half damage, failed save takes full

Acrobatic Attack S&F- Duelist. You make a leaping charge. Make a jump check (DC=opp AC). If you succeed, you can addd +2 attack and damage.


Thanks ahead of time.

 

[mikeym]

I think it's a little too powerful. The question I always ask is: if I were making a character, would I always choose this class? For me, if I was choosing between a monk and this class, I would always choose this one, which implies to me that it's too powerful. If you think the monk is too weak, though, that's a different story.

I think that putting the abilities on STR and INT is pretty strong. One of the biggest drawbacks to monks is that they have to spread out their abilities.

On the other hand, you took out all the ki strikes. I'm used to playing and DMing very low-magic campaigns, so I can't judge how important that is. Perhaps that makes up for the other stuff.

- Mike

 

[Sertimon]

I agree with the Mike, it needs to be toned downed. If you're using both the monk and this class in your game, I really don't think many people would choose the monk anymore. The brawler is stepping on the monk's turf

I would probably leave it at two good saves, one bad: Good Fort/Ref save, Bad Will save (or perhaps Ref as bad) and remove the speed bonus. What I would do is just to remove most of the monk and/or martial arts related abilities (those with Asian/eastern flavor): Still Mind, Slow Fall, Purity of Body, Wholeness of Body, Diamond Body, Diamond Soul, Empty Body and Perfect Self. Just to name a few. Most of the stuff removed has little to do with a brawler or street fighter type of character anyways. I have no idea why you added blindsight. I'd also move up some of the abilities to fill out the gaps more evenly. With all these changes, perhaps changing the HD to d10 would be a good idea.

Hope that helps!

 

[Balgus]

I agree with the Mike, it needs to be toned downed. If you're using both the monk and this class in your game, I really don't think many people would choose the monk anymore. The brawler is stepping on the monk's turf

I had always felt that the monk was a bit out of place in DND. It seemed like all the other classes has a distinct medieval europe taste, and in ocmes a monk- purebred asian.

I would probably leave it at two good saves, one bad: Good Fort/Ref save, Bad Will save (or perhaps Ref as bad) and remove the speed bonus. What I would do is just to remove most of the monk and/or martial arts related abilities (those with Asian/eastern flavor): Still Mind, Slow Fall, Purity of Body, Wholeness of Body, Diamond Body, Diamond Soul, Empty Body and Perfect Self. Just to name a few. Most of the stuff removed has little to do with a brawler or street fighter type of character anyways. I have no idea why you added blindsight. I'd also move up some of the abilities to fill out the gaps more evenly. With all these changes, perhaps changing the HD to d10 would be a good idea.

Hope that helps!

Hmmm... Yeah- I was thinking that too. It's just that I was reading in DMG where it talks about creating new classes, you should take out what you don't want and replace them with comparable abilities from other classes.

OK- I deleted most the stuff that makes the monk him- but kept basically things that weren't oriental or meditation in nature.

saves- as monk
HD- D10 (or maybe still d8)
BAB- as monk, flurry of blows
skills 4+int (skill list- as monk)
Int to AC (as monk's Wis bonus)
can wear light armor (no shields)
weapon list- all simple, handaxe, light pick, siangham, shortsword, sap, light hammer (basically any weapon that is easily accessible, or reradily available to anyone)

1-Stunning Fist (use str instead of wis), unarmed strike
2-Power Punch (as circle kick, but punch), FLURRY OF BLOWS
3-uncanny dodge(cant lose dex)
4-evasion
5-BASE SPEED +5
6-Bonus Feat
7-IMPROVED INI
8-
9-UNCANNY DODGE (cant be flanked)
10-IMPROVED EVASION, BASE SPEED +10
11-Greater Flurry
12-
13-METTLE
14-DEFENSIVE ROLL
15-BASE SPEED +15
16-Acrobatic attack
17-
18-FISTS OF FURY (IMPR CRIT for unarmed attack- stacks with feat)
19-
20-BONUS FEAT, BASE SPEED +20


*changes are in CAPS*

 

[Sertimon]

First of all I want to say it’s much more balanced now! Great work! I agree that the monk seems out of place in the often medieval D&D game, just need to stretch the imagination somewhat.

Does the Unarmed Strike progress at the same rate as the monk or does he start with the Improved Unarmed Strike feat? If it progresses at the same rate, I would probably lower down the damage by one step and upping the HD to d10.

I see the brawler as a more city-oriented character class, perhaps which should be reflected in the Skills? Remove the following from the monk: Diplomacy, Knowledge (arcana), Knowledge (religion), Listen, and Perform. Add the following skills the Brawler skill list: Balance, Bluff, Intimidate, and Knowledge (local). This will set him further apart from the monk.

Change the name of base speed to fast movement +X ft. because it basically works as the barbarian's ability.

Ranger and Rogue are the only PHB class, except the monk that gets Listen and Spot. I would rather let them keep that, just personal preference, nothing to do with balance

I would probably change Fists of Fury to "all critical threats become critical hits" because Improved Critical, Keen or similar abilities usually don't stack anymore. The ability comes rather late, so I don't think it would unbalance the class.

You should check out the Defender base class from the Midnight Campaign Setting. It has game mechanics that you can use to make the Brawler more unique.

That all I can think of right now!

 

[Balgus]

You should check out the Defender base class from the Midnight Campaign Setting. It has game mechanics that you can use to make the Brawler more unique.

Thanks a lot. Surprisingly, I bought that book a while back, but since my DM usually doesn't allow thrid party material in his campaign, I never bothered looking. But is what I was looking for- somewhat. With a little tweaking, I bet he will be fun to play. Especially with all those special abilities.