D&D General Do You Use "Dungeons" In Your Game

[Cordwainer Fish]

what separates the "ruined castle" from the "thieves guild hideout" when deciding what a dungeon is?

Note to self: put my next thieves' guild hideout in a ruined castle.

 

[Mecheon]

For some flavors of dungeon delving, it is an essential part of the experience.

I think its moreso an oldschool thing

As someone who came into things on a more digital side, what with Neverwinter Nights being my go-to introduction, mapping isn't really needed therein. The only time I had to map something out was the Endless Halls in WoW, and if you know the Endless Halls, you know why

Given the map is for my use only, of course I'm going to put all the relevant info on it.

I mean, the map also sort of adds to the atmosphere. You're going to get a different vibe to having changed over from where you were to a specific type of , its part of the visual indicator for being in a new place. Mind, you know, video gamer and all

But, yeah, as a Warcraft player my view on dungeons is more dependent on their goal. A manor house can absolutely be a dungeon, and thanks to a bunch of M+ runs I know that place's layout like the back of my hand. Its still a dungeon, though

 

[Maxperson]

So -- and this is just a question and not judgemental in any way -- for you, what separates the "ruined castle" from the "thieves guild hideout" when deciding what a dungeon is?

Again -- honest question.

Arbitrary feeeeeeelings!!! To me dungeons are old, typically abandoned(except by monsters) places. That's why I included ruined castles, though really any ruin to me is a dungeon.

 

[Remathilis]

Challenges aren't supposed to be fun. If they were, they wouldn't be challenges. And if it means the players have to do some work, so be it.

I take it this means you also don't track food, ammo, etc.

Yup. I got monsters to slay and princesses to rescue. If I wanted to play logistical games with resources and travel, I'd go camping.

 

[AlViking]

Yup. I got monsters to slay and princesses to rescue. If I wanted to play logistical games with resources and travel, I'd go camping.

I take it you don't consider taking one of these camping?

 

[abazaba]

Given the map is for my use only, of course I'm going to put all the relevant info on it.

I think the idea is that you have two 'versions' of the map: one for the DM and another one for the players. The DM map (obviously) has all the notes, locations of traps and secret doorways, etc. But the players map only has the layout of the rooms (and how they interconnect) and things you would obviously notice when you enter the room like for example a few coffins. And then only reveal/draw the parts of the map where the players already have been, so they will not immediately get a total overview of the entire place. This is how our group does it, and we like it that way.

I take it this means you also don't track food, ammo, etc.

In general, we don't really keep track of these kinds of things either. For example, we don't track how long the torch we entered the dungeon with will continue to burn before it goes out. As a minor exception, we only kept track of food when we had to travel through the woods for a few days in order to get from A to B. But even then it was very loose, it was limited to ending each day of travel with a 'hunt for food'. Ranging from caught rat to rabbit to deer, depending on how we rolled the dice. It actually felt more like role-playing than game mechanics, as we did not track if the food we caught was 'enough' and we certainly did not introduce game mechanics like 'exhaustion' when we had to live on rats for a few days. The only thing we do keep strict track of, is gold/coins/etc.

 

[Remathilis]

I take it you don't consider taking one of these camping?
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To be fair, my idea of "roughing it" is not having a heated pool and turndown service, so maybe I'm not the best judge...

 

[saviirkad]

Challenges aren't supposed to be fun. If they were, they wouldn't be challenges. And if it means the players have to do some work, so be it.

I feel the exact opposite. A challenge in a game is supposed to be fun, or it isn't a challenge, it's a chore.

If I wanted to do chores with my friends, I've got dishes, laundry and vacuuming that can be done.

 

[Edgar Ironpelt]

My 'dungeons' tend to be lairs, ranging from the small and simple to larger things in the Bond Villain style. In the last session I ran, I had two very small ones that in hindsight were too small.

Mine are mostly underground, but on occasion I've used a tower, an open-air maze with a large and powerful illusion to make it appear to be underground, and an iceberg that was floating in the air, cloud-castle style.

 

[Lanefan]

I think the idea is that you have two 'versions' of the map: one for the DM and another one for the players. The DM map (obviously) has all the notes, locations of traps and secret doorways, etc. But the players map only has the layout of the rooms (and how they interconnect) and things you would obviously notice when you enter the room like for example a few coffins.

Unless provided by the module, however, the production of that second map means more prep work for me-as-DM; work that the players could be doing on the fly as they explore places. It's also very difficult to keep the as-yet-unexplored parts of such a map hidden, I've found.

Further, any DM-produced map like that will be assumed to be accurate; this an assumption rarely made about player-made maps unless the place is quite small or very easy to map.

"Player maps" provided by modules and usually intended to be given the the players before they arrive at the site are IME often intentionally inaccurate, reflecting errors made by those who (in the fiction) made the map in the first place. As DM I don't want to guess ahead of time what mistakes the PCs will make in mapping, I'd rather leave it up to them...which also leaves a chance they'll get it bang-on right.

And then only reveal/draw the parts of the map where the players already have been, so they will not immediately get a total overview of the entire place. This is how our group does it, and we like it that way.

When they get to a new area, if it's easy to describe I'll just narrate it ("you've entered a 30x20 ft room in the middle of a long side, there is a closed door directly opposite you <go on to narrate room contents etc.>") and if it's at all complex e.g. an odd-shaped area or a natural cavern I'll draw it on the chalkboard. The area also gets drawn out if there's a combat, the chalkboard is also our "battlemat".

But if they don't map it for themselves that's on them. What's on the chalkboard gets erased when the board's needed for something else.

In general, we don't really keep track of these kinds of things either. For example, we don't track how long the torch we entered the dungeon with will continue to burn before it goes out. As a minor exception, we only kept track of food when we had to travel through the woods for a few days in order to get from A to B. But even then it was very loose, it was limited to ending each day of travel with a 'hunt for food'. Ranging from caught rat to rabbit to deer, depending on how we rolled the dice. It actually felt more like role-playing than game mechanics, as we did not track if the food we caught was 'enough' and we certainly did not introduce game mechanics like 'exhaustion' when we had to live on rats for a few days. The only thing we do keep strict track of, is gold/coins/etc.

At higher level I don't concern myself with tracking food and water as much unless there's no Cleric or Druid in the party (very rare) as most days those classes can feed-water a typical party with their spells and carried rations can cover the days when those casters need their spells for other things. At low level before those spells come online, however, it's tracked.

Ditto light: after about 5th level there's multiple caster classes who can produce Continual Light effects on a whim during downtime, meaning everyone can easily have as many "light rocks" as they want. At low level, or if a null-magic area temporarily shuts down their light rocks*, tracking light-source durations is huge mostly because night-vision that works indoors is limited to just a very few species in my game.

Finances are tracked closely at all times. Ammo is also tracked.

* - not long ago a party of decent-level characters with about 25 light rocks between them ran into an underground null-magic area. Everything went dark, and maybe one character had underground vision. Frantic search of character sheets for mundane light sources turned up exactly three tallow candles in total, i.e. very poor light for maybe an hour tops. Fortunately for the PCs the null-magic area wasn't that big; and next time they were in town there was a minor run on torches...