Eliminating the Vancian Wizard altogether

Kzach

Banned
Banned
Wizards having two dailies and two utilities per slot is really starting to bug me. I want to get rid of it and limit them to one per slot like every other class. But at the same time, I don't want to gimp wizards and rip-off players.

Any suggestions on how I could do this?
 
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What specifically about the "daily/utility thing" don't you like?

Is it that there are limits at all on how often you can use your powers? So you would prefer every power to be at-will?

Is it that you have to select a certain number of powers from a list, and can't use any powers you don't select? So you would prefer, say, that if a character had 3 encounter powers then he could use 3 encounter powers per encounter, but he doesn't have to preselect which 3 they are?

Is it that once you use a spell, you can use a different spell but can't use that same spell again? Then maybe what you could do is say that if a character has X daily powers, he has X total uses of daily powers but he can divide them up however he wants (so if he had three daily powers, he could use one three times or one twice and one once, etc.)

Is it that the daily/encounter/utility system works the same way for martial classes and magic classes, and you would prefer that it work differently?

It would be a lot easier for us to give helpful suggestions if you were more specific about what the problem is.
 

The whole daily/utility thing is pissing me off. I'm trying to think of ways in which to do away with it entirely whilst not ripping wizard players off.

Any suggestions?

Modify Daily/Utility Powers:
Figure a way to lessen their power to the level of an encounter ability. For powers with a [W] in their damage, the easiest way would probably to reduce the multiplier, so a 3[W] daily power becomes a 2[W] encounter power.

Modify the Dailiy Recharge/Use Mechanic
You can use only one Daily power per encounter. (But get the full benefit).
Use the monster recharge ability. After the first daily power has been used in an encounter, roll 1d6 each round. On a 6, you can use another daily power. You can still use every daily power only once per encounter. As a further baseline, you should probably think about how to modify the recharge value. Maybe if you get access to paragon powers, heroic tier powers recharge on a 5 or 6. If you get access to epic powers, heroic recharge on 4, 5 and 6, and paragon on 5 and 6.
Instead of a d6, you could also use a save at the end of each turn - a 20 recharges.
Any recharge mechanic will probably improve the power of the PCs, but reduces their control a little bit.

More complicated Options are possible, use at own peril.
There are certainly further ways imaginable. You could try to create conditions - to use a encounter power, you have to hit twice in a row with an at-will, encounter, daily or basic attack, to use a daily power, you have to hit four times in a row with at-will, encounter, basic attack or daily.
Or you need to spend a standard action to "charge" a encounter, and a second standard action to charge a daily power. (Representing your attempts to channel mana/get into a better combat position).
 

The whole daily/utility thing is pissing me off. I'm trying to think of ways in which to do away with it entirely whilst not ripping wizard players off.

Any suggestions?

I don't know if it would be bad to do it, but you could just ditch the preparation thing altogether, making the wizard more like the 3e sorcerer. A wizard knows twice as many utilities and dailies as he has "slots" to use and can choose which he will cast at the time he casts them. Once one is used, it is used for the day (or encounter for those utilities that are encouner powers). At highest levels, a wizard will have six dailies (plus his one from his paragon path) and he will be able to choose any three of them to use during the day (plus using the one from his paragon path).

Clearly this enhances versatility but doesn't really increase their total resources.

DC
 

My group does exactly that, the wizard can use all his/her daily and utility powers, not just choose one. So far, I think it's a geart solution, cause I didn't like the pick one crap. It's the whole vanician magic thing again, and I can't stand it. So wizards get a slight more powers than every one else.

Works nicely as far as I'm concerned. The wizard likes it also.

Sammy
 

Giving them double the amount of dailies and utilities just makes them doubly as powerful. Giving them choice between either or whenever they like is too flexible.

There has to be some alternative that equals the power of swapping between two different powers for each slot every day.
 

I cant see what the problem is... wizards have low enough damage and crap enough feats available to them (esp. at heroic tier) to warrant having something cool about them that other classes dont have, dont you think... well I do any way.
 

I cant see what the problem is... wizards have low enough damage and crap enough feats available to them (esp. at heroic tier) to warrant having something cool about them that other classes dont have, dont you think... well I do any way.

It's annoying and goes against the general trend of 4e to minimise complexity.

And I just don't like it.

If you don't like that or don't agree, feel free to start your own thread.
 

I think it is stupid that if they have an encounter or daily in their spell book, it just disappears and is replaced by another if they choose a different one. So I kept everything the same except that wizards powers belong to no spell book. The get to choose between the two encounter or two daily ones that they have 'memorized'.

Spell books are strictly the domain of Rituals and magic items. In my campaign their is not a create item or potion ritual. Characters can find formulas for various types of magic items that they can bind into ritual book.
 

How about this?

Master of Spells
Drawing upon their studies and comprehensive understanding of magic, Wizards can cast a wide variety of spells. Once per day as a free action, a Wizard can exchange one of his daily or utility spells for another spell of the same type and level. For example, a Wizard could replace his Fireball spell with Bigby's Icy Grasp, or replace his Feather Fall spell with Shield. The new spell remains in the Wizard's mind until he takes an extended rest.

This replaces the Wizard's Spellbook class feature.

This allows you to dispense with the complexity of preparation but it still lets Wizards keep some of the flexibility of it.
 

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