Fantasy novel lovers thread

[Minion X]

if a book uses supernatural elements to speculate about how societies and people could be and how that reflects on humanity, then does it count as sci-fi even if it’s using magic and dragons? If a book uses currently impossible technology to look back on a golden age and wax nostalgic about how things were better in the old days, does that count as fantasy?

I would say that fantasy expresses a personal longing for more simple yet exciting times and circumstances, rather than reflecting any political or social beliefs that the past was better. Like the paradox of the 60s counterculture movement falling in love with a trilogy of books by an Oxford professor about a divinely appointed king righteously smiting his wicked, sub-human foes with the help of three country squires and their manservant.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I guess if you have a real world historical setting but with magic and wizards you also need an extremely sturdy Masquerade so that our history and society aren’t affected.

Harry Potter is basically that now in the sense it all happens 1980-1997 or so (though of course I’m cheating because it was kind of modern when it was written). I suppose the Fantastic Beasts films are set in the actual past.

I read a Rivers of London novella set in the 1930s.

 

[Minion X]

It's been a while since I read the books. I must have forgotten all the glamour and good times and happy endings.

I'm reading them right now and it's pure crack with all the swords, dresses and food, and the beautiful people and their court intrigues. The little bit of shite and mud around the edges only makes the gold shine all the brighter, like poor people on the streets in a Gilded Age drama.

PS: Looks like you can pull the FFXIV trick and get around censorship by using endearing Britishisms when swearing.

 

[Minion X]

Historical fiction is a huge genre of its own, definitely not fantasy. And it’s often nostalgic, even when the times described were seriously grim by modern standards (eg Ellis Peters’ Cadfael stories). It overlaps with detective fiction more often than fantasy.

Also formerly contemporary novels that are now idolized for their portayal of a more romantic past, like Pride and Prejudice.

 

[jian]

Also formerly contemporary novels that are now idolized for their portayal of a more romantic past, like Pride and Prejudice.

Yes, it’s very weird that people are complaining about Savage House which is set in 18th century England and is thus technically Georgian but is exactly as bawdy, unsentimental, satirical, and scatological as anything written at the time. But it upsets people whose only understanding of the Georgian period is based on Austen and Bridgerton to be made aware of this.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Also formerly contemporary novels that are now idolized for their portayal of a more romantic past, like Pride and Prejudice.

Pride and Prejudice is a funny and insightful book. I’m not sure how many of those cosplayers have actually read it.

Nostalgia certainly was not the author’s intent!

 

[Minion X]

Pride and Prejudice is a funny and insightful book. I’m not sure how many of those cosplayers have actually read it.

Nostalgia certainly was not the author’s intent!

Time makes fools of us all and historic fiction out of every modern drama.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Bridgerton

You could certainly make a case that Bridgerton is fantasy, since it is set in a fictional world entirely unlike the real one. But imaginary worlds without magic and dragons are usually classed under science fiction.

 

[Autumnal]

In his book Weird Fiction: A Genre Study, Michael Cisco argues that each genre has a major mode and a minor mode. In the major mode, the disrupted order of things is restored, even though there may be serious costs for changes along the way. In the minor mode, there’s a permanent change in the order of things, even though there may still be some significant consequences.

The mixture differs for each genre. Some are dominated by one more or the other,’and the boundaries of what’s restorable or not vary. But both types of story are present for each. The major mode is usually more prominent, because a lot of readers, like a lot of humans generally, like closure along with their wild adventure. But that doesn’t mean minor mosss don’t also flourish.

 

[MNblockhead]

The best audiobooks, in my opinion, are Rivers of London (read mostly by Kobna Holdbrook-Smith, who somehow manages to make every single voice distinct - he's also done A Wizard of Earthsea and The Farthest Shore), the Gentleman Bastards (except for the fact that the series isn't ever going to be finished), and Joe Abercrombie's books read by Steven Pacey. He injects just the right level of cynicism for grimdark fantasy.

A good audiobook is a gem, but it requires the right combination of a good book and a good voice actor. I've noped out of quite a few recordings because the narration was jarring.

Thanks for the recommendations. Rivers of London is already on my wish list, so I think maybe that should be my next book. I already listened to the Lies of Locke Lamora, but I feel like that might have been a better book to enjoy in print due to the style. Though the narration was top notch. I enjoyed the book, but I didn't become hooked on the setting and am not compelled to continue reading the other books in the Gentleman Bastards series.

What is a good first book for someone who has never ready/listened to any of Abercrombie's books?

This weekend I've been listening to The Emperor's Soul, the first book I've ever listened to/read by Brandon Sanderson. I'm really enjoying it. It is well and tightly written and I'm liking the characters, plot, and the sense of the world building behind it. I know he's written long series set in the same world, but this is my first foray into Cosmere. He writing style is idea for audio books. The prose is less literary and more direct, while not feeling like a YA novel. I mean that positively, not as a criticism. Some books the way the book is written is as important as the characters, plot, and world building (e.g., Name of the Rose, The Last Unicorn...) and I prefer to read, not listen to, such books. Anyway, I find Sanderson's writing style lends itself to the audiobook format and I think Angela Lin does a good job (though weaker trying to do male voices, compared to other female narrators like Andrea Parsneau).

For those familiar with Sanderson's books, if I want to read more of his books set in Cosmere, should my next book be Mistborn: The Final Empire?