D&D General Fixing the Great Weapon Fighting Style

[CreamCloud0]

I don't really.

I think the exploration of raw damage bonuses don't match the fictions and histories that inspire the game

It’s not really damage I want to explore but rather weapons with more unique traits and playstyles,

And I couldn’t really care about historical accuracies given what the rest of the game contains, making historically accurate weaponry in DnD is like putting a band-aid on a missing limb.

 

[Horwath]

if we get again fighting styles as feats, then it must be a half-feat and most of them need buff.

only FS that are worth half a feat are:
Archery
Defense
TWF,

GWF is not worth a quarter feat by it self.
maybe if we take 2014 wording with 2024 mechanics(used for all dice), then maybe for some builds if may be worth the paper it is printed on.

but, if you at your best day add +1 damage on a successful hit, then that is just a waste of page space and as a DM, it's your duty to warn players about trap choices.

 

[Minigiant]

What if the answer isn't more damage, but more reach?

When I think of people excellent at the big ass melee weapons I think of them fighting from behind compatriots, or over walls and hedges.

Having an extra 5' of reach allows fun tactical choices that damage bonuses don't

Great Weapon Fighting
Fighting Style Feat (Prerequisite: Fighting Style Feature)
When you make a Melee weapon attack that you are holding with two hands on your turn, you can increase your reach for that attack by 5 feet. The weapon must have the Two-Handed or Versatile property to gain this benefit.

 

[Tessarael]

Great Weapon Fighting
Fighting Style Feat (Prerequisite: Fighting Style Feature)
When you make a Melee weapon attack that you are holding with two hands on your turn, you can increase your reach for that attack by 5 feet. The weapon must have the Two-Handed or Versatile property to gain this benefit.

Unfortunately, I think this is still not worth it. Reach is very situational and seldom needed. Give it an additional +1 damage, and I would take it grudgingly as a two-handed weapon wielder if there were no other good options, but I'd still prefer Defense for +1 AC over this. I.e., Great Weapon Fighting needs to give +2 damage to be on par with the other fighting styles, in my opinion. Now if you gave me the reach +5' on my turn and +2 damage, I'd be very happy, but maybe that would be too good.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Technically dueling increases damage more

But only for weapons that do less damage in the first place!

 

[Horwath]

Unfortunately, I think this is still not worth it. Reach is very situational and seldom needed. Give it an additional +1 damage, and I would take it grudgingly as a two-handed weapon wielder if there were no other good options, but I'd still prefer Defense for +1 AC over this. I.e., Great Weapon Fighting needs to give +2 damage to be on par with the other fighting styles, in my opinion. Now if you gave me the reach +5' on my turn and +2 damage, I'd be very happy, but maybe that would be too good.

best 1H weapon for dueling style is 1d8, and lets say +5 ability.
that turns 9,5 avg damage to 11,5 avg damage. +21% increase.

we take best 2H weapon, greatsword,
it's 12 damage on average(2d6+5), add +21% to that, it's 14,52, so round up to 15. to have a difference.
just make GWFS add +3 damage, or +2 damage for 2H ranged weapons.

that will make up for absurdity that if you have both dueling style and GWF style and versatile weapon, you deal more damage with 1Handed attacks:
1d8+7 vs 1d10+5(1&2 counted as 3)
11,5 vs 10,8

 

[Horwath]

or if people want current style, it should scale min worth by damage die.

d4, min roll 3, average from 2,5 to 3,25, +30%, +10% with +5 mod
d6, min roll 4, average from 3,5 to 4,5, +29%, +12% with +5 mod
d8, min roll 5, average from 4,5 to 5,75, +28%, +13% with +5 mod
d10, min roll 6, average from 5,5 to 7, +27%, +14% with +5 mod
d12, min roll 7, average from 6,5 to 8,25, +27%, +15% with +5 mod

 

[Paul Farquhar]

that will make up for absurdity that if you have both dueling style and GWF style and versatile weapon

It’s absurd that anyone would try to use great weapon style with a versatile weapon. If you do something stupid you shouldn’t be surprised if you get stupid results. GW style is balanced around the idea that you are using it with a weapon that has higher base damage in the first place, and gives you the best achievable fighter DPS (duel wield builds aside).

 

[Horwath]

It’s absurd that anyone would try to use great weapon style with a versatile weapon. If you do something stupid you shouldn’t be surprised if you get stupid results. GW style is balanced around the idea that you are using it with a weapon that has higher base damage in the first place, and gives you the best achievable fighter DPS (duel wield builds aside).

longsword with versatile has same base damage as reach weapons(d10) that are Heavy 2Handed melee weapons.
so clearly, it was intended to be used with d10 base damage die.

talk about bad weapon balance, but that is another topic.

 

[Silam]

that will make up for absurdity that if you have both dueling style and GWF style and versatile weapon, you deal more damage with 1Handed attacks:
1d8+7 vs 1d10+5(1&2 counted as 3)
11,5 vs 10,8

That is a very interesting observation.

A bit more of a niche discussion, but… what is the best pair of fighting styles that a Champion 7 should take ?