GMW on weapons - temporary hit points or Con bonus?

[Hypersmurf]

Each + of enhancement bonus gives a weapon an extra point of hardness and an extra hit point.

Fred the Fighter has a +1 Keen Flaming Shocking Ghost Touch Longsword of Speed. Hardness 11, hit points 6.

He has Carl the Cleric cast GMW to bump it up to +5 - Hardness 15, hit points 10.

Olly the Ogre has a Huge greataxe and the Sunder feat. Walter the Wizard also casts GMW, bringing the axe to +5 (and now capable of damaging Fred's sword).

In round one of combat, Olly strikes at Fred's weapon. He succeeds, dealing 22 points of damage. Less 15 points of hardness, the sword sustains 7 points of damage, dropping to 3 hit points.

In round 2, Walter casts a Dispel Magic that gets rid of Carl's GMW spell. Fred's longsword is now +1 again.

Should those extra hit points from GMW be treated like temporary hit points - meaning the +1 sword has 3 hit points remaining - or like bonus hit points from an enhanced Con score - meaning the sword is at -1 hit points and broken?

-Hyp.

 

[Berk]

temporary

 

[Malin Genie]

Of course, it is not certain that GMW actually provides the bonus hardness and hp in the first place.

While it provides a temporary enhancement bonus, it nowhere specifically states that it provides the hardness/hp usually associated with such a bonus, so you could argue the point either way.

Personally I think GMW is strong enough without it (and that's speaking as the player of a bard who casts GMW on a frequent basis....)

 

[Hypersmurf]

Personally I think GMW is strong enough without it...

So in your opinion, can a GMW(+3) longsword damage a +2 axe? Can a +2 axe damage a GMW(+3) longsword?

-Hyp.

 

[Someone]

Forget the GMW. You have the same problem with normal magic weapons and Antimagic Field, so you can stay in topic.

Rephrasing the problem: A +5 longsword with 8 points of damage enters an Antimagic field. Does it break, or not?

I´d say yes.

 

[Malin Genie]

The answers are interrelated.

I would suggest that the process of crafting a magical weapon increases the hardness and hp of the material permanently, as a byproduct. Conversely, magical effects that temporarily give an enhancement bonus do not affect the material of which the weapon is made.

So in an anti-magic field a +5 sword would not lose the bonus hp or hardness - even though it was originally caused by magic, it is a permanent change to the material.

 

[Staffan]

So in an anti-magic field a +5 sword would not lose the bonus hp or hardness - even though it was originally caused by magic, it is a permanent change to the material.

Though it *would* lose the immunity to damage from +4 or lesser weapons.

 

[Pax]

The answers are interrelated.

I would suggest that the process of crafting a magical weapon increases the hardness and hp of the material permanently, as a byproduct. Conversely, magical effects that temporarily give an enhancement bonus do not affect the material of which the weapon is made.

So in an anti-magic field a +5 sword would not lose the bonus hp or hardness - even though it was originally caused by magic, it is a permanent change to the material.

Works for me.

Mirrors the "Magically treated materials" in Magic of Faerun -- whose properties DO continue to function, even in an antimagic field (typically +1 damage of a specific elemental type)

 

[Destil]

The answers are interrelated.

I would suggest that the process of crafting a magical weapon increases the hardness and hp of the material permanently, as a byproduct. Conversely, magical effects that temporarily give an enhancement bonus do not affect the material of which the weapon is made.

So in an anti-magic field a +5 sword would not lose the bonus hp or hardness - even though it was originally caused by magic, it is a permanent change to the material.

This is compatable with the rules for creating golems and undead magicaly, so I think it's the best logical solution.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Though it *would* lose the immunity to damage from +4 or lesser weapons.

Which returns us to the GMW question.

An axe with GMW(+2) cast on it does not gain hardness, does not gain hit points, but does gain the ability to break +2 weapons, and does gain immunity to +1 or non-magical weapons?

I'm not sure I see it. The spell "gives a weapon an enhancement bonus". The four benefits (hardness, hitpoints, can break, can't be broken) apply to weapons with an enhancement bonus.

I can understand the "all benefits apply" argument (all are lost in an anti-magic field, all are granted by GMW).

I can understand the "all benefits are a function of the Craft Arms and Armor process" (none lost in an anti-magic field, none granted by GMW).

But I don't understand picking-and-choosing... where is the support for it?

"Furthermore, while a magic sword does not function magically within the area, it is still a sword (and a masterwork sword at that)."

I submit that if you take two identical masterwork swords, use Craft Arms and Armor to make one of them +1, and then take both into an AntiMagic Field, they should be indistinguishable. Why does the magic one have more hardness? Because it's magic. Take magic away, and it should be exactly the same as its twin. Same hardness, same hit points, same vulnerability to a non-magical sledgehammer.

-Hyp.