D&D General If you had to choose between quality of story or combat

[Maxperson]

Little addition: Roleplaying imho is you got your char, you roleplay their personality, but their limits are described by their stats and skills.
Some people confuse that with playing an avatar of themselves, or idealized selves.

With our disputed example for me that means, Just because you OOC think the DM has hidden a trap although my char failed the roll, it doesn't mean that your char reasonably thinks the same.

Again, flat earthers are just the tip of the iceberg in ignoring facts and reality to believe something else. That makes it very reasonable to be unreasonable in belief in D&D as well. People act that way and PCs are people.

It doesn't matter why the PC is dead set on believing the door is trapped. He believes it and that's all that really matters.

 

[tombowings]

Also, if if I remember correctly, in Pendragon, the GM is only supposed to ask for Passion and Trait rolls for values higher than 16, and choosing (or reaching) a Passion or Trait value of 16 or high is wholly inside the players' control.

But I could be misremembering.

 

[Coroc]

Again, flat earthers are just the tip of the iceberg in ignoring facts and reality to believe something else. That makes it very reasonable to be unreasonable in belief in D&D as well. People act that way and PCs are people.

It doesn't matter why the PC is dead set on believing the door is trapped. He believes it and that's all that really matters.

well except his skill is not sufficient to believe it.

 

[bsss]

For some of use the restrictions on who our character is, what they think and feel matters to some of us. If you don't care, you don't.

So this whole time, the objective measure of how much the game restricts choices made by the characters during play depended on who was doing the measuring and what they considered restrictions? Fiddlesticks! We were so close.

 

[Maxperson]

well except his skill is not sufficient to believe it.

That doesn't even make sense. Skill has nothing to do with whether or not you believe something. You can be unskilled and believe that the door is trapped, or very skilled and believe that the door is trapped.

 

[bsss]

That doesn't even make sense. Skill has nothing to do with whether or not you believe something. You can be unskilled and believe that the door is trapped, or very skilled and believe that the door is trapped.

What I think they're getting at is that it's equally valid for the player to conclude that the game results dictate that the character was incapable of convincing themselves the door was trapped, and the player is roleplaying the character accordingly. The definition of the character (and the die results) affect how the character is played in the fiction, rather than the character being treated as an avatar the player interfaces with the fiction through.

 

[CreamCloud0]

Little addition: Roleplaying imho is you got your char, you roleplay their personality, but their limits are described by their stats and skills.
Some people confuse that with playing an avatar of themselves, or idealized selves.

With our disputed example for me that means, Just because you OOC think the DM has hidden a trap although my char failed the roll, it doesn't mean that your char reasonably thinks the same.

it's like, nobody RP's their barbarian as thinking he can still move that boulder after a failed athletics check, because it was just objectively proven he can't, but people are still more than content to hold onto their own suspicions and opinions after failing insight checks and the like, and the only reason they do this is because the character has a second brain called 'the player' who knows they only think that now because of a 4 on the dice, even when objectively, the character shouldn't know that.

 

[Swarmkeeper]

well except his skill is not sufficient to believe it.

That doesn't even make sense. Skill has nothing to do with whether or not you believe something. You can be unskilled and believe that the door is trapped, or very skilled and believe that the door is trapped.

Not to mention the rules of 5e/5.5e do not specify the player must roleplay according to their PC’s stats/skills. It’s still the player’s choice to determine how their character thinks, acts, and speaks.

 

[payn]

If a lot of players operate as if their characters are flat earthers this thread suddenly makes a lot of sense. That’s a really strange default template to use but who am I to argue with folks who want to.

 

[AlViking]

So this whole time, the objective measure of how much the game restricts choices made by the characters during play depended on who was doing the measuring and what they considered restrictions? Fiddlesticks! We were so close.

Gosh darnit! Here I thought people wanted to have a gosh darn serious conversation instead of just making fun of other people's preferences! Thanks for dispelling my misconceptions!