D&D General In defense of Shocking Grasp

[SkidAce]

It's a fine spell.

And spell ranking is a hobby for people with rhotacism.

I looked at the definition of rhotacism and I dont understand your meaning.

 

[Rabulias]

I looked at the definition of rhotacism and I dont understand your meaning.

Try saying "spell ranking" with that definition in mind.

 

[SkidAce]

Try saying "spell ranking" with that definition in mind.

AHHHHHH

...got it...

 

[FrogReaver]

Don't even get me started on these white-room analyses.

My biggest pet peeve with white rooms are how they always use average dice results. I understand the reasoning, but it gives a false confidence...dice rolls are never that reliable! On your turn, you don't get to roll the d20 a bunch of times and average the result--you get to roll once, and that one roll is just as likely to be a 2 or 3 instead of a 10 or 11. Your white-room analysis needs to account for that.

If it creates false confidence, that’s usually a misunderstanding of expected value rather than an issue with using averages.

 

[FrogReaver]

One of my favorite Sorcerer/Wizard spells is Shocking Grasp. But whenever I read people’s spells rankings, it always seems to rank low on the Cantrip tier lists. So, I will attempt to make a case for it.

The biggest criticism I’ve read is that it’s a Touch spell and squishy characters don’t want to be in melee combat. True. However, sometimes melee combat comes to you, like it or not. In those instances, people typically recommend casting something like the Level 2 spell Misty Step to flee from your enemies.

But I feel it’s better to save the 2nd Level Spell Slot by casting a Cantrip, causing some damage to your enemy (1d8 per tier of play), and running away without provoking an Opportunity Attack. And since the enemy can’t make an Opportunity Attack until the start of their next turn, it might also allow for other squishy party members and/or NPCs to run away as well. I basically like to use it as an “oh %#*>” spell.

So there’s my argument in favor of an oft maligned Cantrip. I’m sure I’m overlooking something obvious (low number of Cantrips known, or something), so I look forward to the counter arguments to come.

Tactically I love shocking grasp. It’s never my top pick but it’s always a consideration for me.

The tactical use is usually something like enemy engages you, melee ally engages that enemy. Shocking Grasp then walk away so the enemy has to risk an OA to continue attacking you.

It can also be used similarly to help an ally get away.

It can also be used to to help the whole party continue to kite. Slow effects and shocking grasp synergies very well in kiting situations - often theoretically optimal but due to actual play doesn’t come up often. Barbarian is going to Barbarian, tactics be damned.

The bigger concern is there are a ton of good cantrips, arguably better for multiple other situations. So it’s not so much that shocking grasp is bad, it’s that it’s that the competition is stacked.

 

[Kobold Stew]

It's a fine cantrip, and, given that it is not used regularly by many casters and is only a backup, additionally can benefit from a Sorcerer's Distant Spell , shutting down opportunity attacks for your allies even when you are up to 30' away. That can be effective for a tactical retreat, but it cant be the character's modus operandi (you wouldn't have enough Sorcery points).

I think one reason the spell has its reputation is that it was significantly weakened in 2024 -- instead of shutting down reactions, it now only shuts down opportunity attacks. That change in the rider makes the 2024 spell significantly weaker than 2014, and for some people that leaves a sour taste (even if, as you note, it can still be effective). Also removed was the advantage vs creatures in metal -- another perceived nerf, even if it didn't come into play often.

 

[FrogReaver]

Not the good ones.

@Silam what was so funny about this?

 

[Silam]

Additionally, a successful landing of the spell could allow any number of allies to move away, or to even step in,

I was going to say that. For a mobile gish character who otherwise has no access to free/bonus Disengage, this is fantastic. Sometimes, you want to wade through the melee and get to the other side of the mob (though it’s less common in 5e since flanking disappeared, but still…).

It can also be especially interesting on a Multi-Cantrip Build. You could potentially neuter the opportunity attack of several foes in a single round.

With 2014 Rules, it can also be helpful (if risky) to shut down an opponent with an obnoxious Reaction. Tired of counterspell from the Big Bad? A lowly cantrip might be for you...

Unless they use Counterspell to cancel out your cantrip first … (which is a very expensive use of a 3rd level spell, but a funny one every once in a while…)

It's a fine cantrip, and, given that it is not used regularly by many casters and is only a backup, additionally can benefit from a Sorcerer's Distant Spell , shutting down opportunity attacks for your allies even when you are up to 30' away.

Or an Owl familiar delivering that touch to help a distant ally get away.

Also removed was the advantage vs creatures in metal -- another perceived nerf, even if it didn't come into play often.

That is so dumb. They should have kept that mechanic. It’s been around forever. 2e, 3.5e, 5.0e… the ensimplification is going too far at times…

 

[Koloth]

I liked the 3.0 version better. The 'Until Discharged' version meant that you could pre cast it before the planned or possible usage. Now it is just another boring damage spell.

 

[Silam]

@Silam what was so funny about this?

It just struck me as a silly school recess type of argument… it’s clear some folks like theory crafting and others don’t, and it’s unlikely anyone will change their mind just by arguing about it