D&D General Is D&D Beyond Exclusivity Bad for D&D?

[rabirin]

We disagree. If you play D&D you know what a subclass is. No one should be buying a Ravenloft book without also having the PHB - it would be pretty useless if you did. The book tells you on the back page that you need the PHB.

If you know enough about the book that you know that it includes specific subclasses I find it difficult to believe you don't know how to play the game or at the very least google "What does subclass mean". By your standard, we could never have any expansions at all. Every expansion relies on having at least the PHB or the free basic rules.

Huh, funnily enough, if you look up pre-order information for the physical book, it does not tell you anywhere that you require content from Eberron: Forge of the Artificer to play the Reanimator Artificer.

 

[SlyFlourish]

If you are not the same one who complained on Youtube about $140 payment requiring 3 books to play a new artificer class on a "Lazy TPG Talk Show" and author of "Return of the Lazy Dungeon Master", who has cheap products and prefers cheap gaming materials from publishers other than yourself: then I apologize for calling you cheap and lazy.

If you are, then I appreciate your insite from that video on the artificer and your review of the new game show by Hasbro for Ravenloft.

I am indeed the same Mike Shea who authored Return of the Lazy Dungeon Master (and sells the PDF for $7) and the host of the Lazy RPG Talk Show. Glad you like the show!

I am indeed interested in helping GMs get a great value for their money in this hobby. One of the things I love about this hobby is that you can enjoy it for basically zero dollars (go steal a pencil at the dog track or your local library!) or you can basically spend whatever you want on it (invite a few dozen friends to enjoy RPGs at a castle!).

But these are hard economic times for everyone and I'm out to help GMs enjoy the hobby whatever their budget so I look for areas where they can get great material for their money.

WOTC essentially doubled the price of their products recently. The two Forgotten Realms books ($110 when you buy them together), for example, have the same word count as the single $50 Eberron Rising from the Last War book from a few years back. The three new core books are a great value – the same $150 we paid back in 2014 not even increased for inflation.

WOTC knows the importance of that value when it comes to this new artificer subclass by giving you the subclass on D&D Beyond when you buy the Ravenloft book – but not for the physical books themselves.

My proposed solution? Release the artificer in the 5.2 SRD so people can use that with the Ravenloft book and not have to drop another $30 on an Eberron-focused book that doesn't have anything else to do with Ravenloft. Also, it lets other publishers publish artificer subclasses and then WOTC can find the best ones and bring them on over to D&D Beyond if they want. Everyone wins.

Am I cheap? No. Man, I spend a ton of money on this game. Now I run an RPG publishing business so I have the money to spend on it. But I am out to help GMs find great value in RPGs all over the place. Yochai Gal's One Shot World and Cairn are amazing values, for example.

 

[mamba]

Huh, funnily enough, if you look up pre-order information for the physical book, it does not tell you anywhere that you require content from Eberron: Forge of the Artificer to play the Reanimator Artificer.

does it yell you that you need the PHB for the other ones?

 

[SlyFlourish]

From what I have been reading and seeing in videos, says that is wrong. It seems many people are willing to buy a book for one thing in it and the rest of the book goes unused. The "ethical" people that is, while others will do it the unethical way to get it; others still will not buy anything and use an SRD.


I refer back to the Lazy RPG Talk Show guy. That is something he would be more ready to discuss, but my understanding is:

You get 1 book you must buy as a player or use an SRD. Then it was that any book you bought would add full details for one of these new classes. It seeks this book changed that? He claims several times he works with Wizards and gets 0romotional matetial. Either that is a boikerplate disclaimer, or due to repeated mention in those 5 minutes, he has the product but must be under NDA until street date to reveal contents. What he revealed, however, was lack of contents he feels should have been present.

WOTC had been pretty clear for years that their intention was that all you needed were the three core books and whatever other book you added. No book required another book outside of the three core books. That's changed since the release of D&D 2024 in some subtle and now not so subtle ways.

 

[SlyFlourish]

I think you are missing something, "software as service" model. If something is exclusive on a website, then when the website disappears or changes to the new thing, you have lost your purchase. So maybe your breakdown should also be "buying" or "renting".

"purchasing a limited license" is the technically correct transaction decription I think.

 

[rabirin]

does it yell you that you need the PHB for the other ones?

Fun story: you don't, because the core classes are available in the free rules posted online. So if you only buy the Ravenloft book, without having purchased any other 5e/5.5e/5.05e/5.-5e book, every subclass is playable without making any additional purchase...except for the Reanimator Artificer, because the base class is only officially available in a paid product.

 

[SothFan]

steal a pencil at the dog track or your local library

Got a few from the Powerball station at the grocery. Love some golf pencils, but do not play golf or mini golf.

 

[AlViking]

Huh, funnily enough, if you look up pre-order information for the physical book, it does not tell you anywhere that you require content from Eberron: Forge of the Artificer to play the Reanimator Artificer.

Huh, funnily enough anyone who has read anything at all about how D&D works knows what a subclass is.

 

[SothFan]

"purchasing a limited license" is the technically correct transaction decription I think.

I have learned more about this game from you and your videos than I have anyone here or the Dungeon Masters program. I am going back to my Liked list and subscribing to your channel for that reason alone.

 

[SothFan]

Return of the Lazy Dungeon Master (and sells the PDF for $7)

two Forgotten Realms books ($110 when you buy them together), for example, have the same word count as the single $50 Eberron Rising from the Last War book from a few years back. The three new core books are a great value – the same $150 we paid back in 2014 not even increased for inflation

By comparison, I would call $7 cheap.