D&D 5E (2024) Is the War Cleric Being Slept On?

[Zardnaar]

Nah, Fighter 1/War Cleric 3 you get second attack level earlier. Remember, most battles in D&D don't last over 3 rounds and War Priest recharges on Short rest, so if you have WIS 16-17 you effectively have extra attack by level 4. This is also more reliable than GWM because that activates bonus action attack only on a crit or kill. Also with Archety fightign style and bless you'll likely never miss on ranged attack (+3-6 to all attack rolls) so it's perfect for ranged builds. You can also then combo it with Mark of the Storm and Potent Dragonmark, by level 7 when you get general feat you will be able to cast Conjure Minor Elementals, so by level 8 you do 3 attacks (5 with action surge) for big damage. You also will probably never fail a skill check between Tactical Mind and Guidance. It is a good build for where most games are, levels 1-7. Level 11 is irrelevant becaust nobody plays beyond level 10.

Your behind on spell levels. Build doesnt look terrible though. Would be playable from lvl 1 as well.

That dragonmark builds even better on a pure fighter.

Level 10 war clerics kinda absurd. I haven't seen one post lvl 12. I have seen other clerics though. Conjure celestial is absurd its just a better spirit guardians generally.

Its better than the internet assumes when it got rated near release, CME is over rated (and got nerfed).

 

[TwoSix]

. Level 11 is irrelevant becaust nobody plays beyond level 10.

People are missing out. Tier 3 is absolutely a sweet spot for 5e play.

 

[Tigris]

Nah, Fighter 1/War Cleric 3 you get second attack level earlier. Remember, most battles in D&D don't last over 3 rounds and War Priest recharges on Short rest, so if you have WIS 16-17 you effectively have extra attack by level 4. This is also more reliable than GWM because that activates bonus action attack only on a crit or kill. Also with Archety fightign style and bless you'll likely never miss on ranged attack (+3-6 to all attack rolls) so it's perfect for ranged builds. You can also then combo it with Mark of the Storm and Potent Dragonmark, by level 7 when you get general feat you will be able to cast Conjure Minor Elementals, so by level 8 you do 3 attacks (5 with action surge) for big damage. You also will probably never fail a skill check between Tactical Mind and Guidance. It is a good build for where most games are, levels 1-7. Level 11 is irrelevant becaust nobody plays beyond level 10.

You get the second attack 1 level earlier, but you miss out on 1 ASI, and action surge and the really strong fighter subclasses until way later. Most fighter subclasses are way stronger than the warpriest.

You can get guidance with an origin feat then the tactical mind + guidance already happens level 2 and also other people can cast guidance.


Level 5 your action surge only gives +1 attack, where pure fighter would bring 2.


Also there is not only GWM there is also polearm fighting which also brings a minor action attack (and also a reaction attack).


I really cant see me ever doing this.

 

[Zardnaar]

People are missing out. Tier 3 is absolutely a sweet spot for 5e play.

Not really. Traditionally its 3-7 or 3-8 and 5E keeps that tradition going.
Game changes a lot at 5th level and 11th imho. Eg upcast aid and heroes feast spells, force cage etc.

5.5 specifically combat slows down do to hit point bloat unless the DM uses a single critter.

RAW CR 16+ can turn up around lvl 10 depending on party size. A few of them have massive initiative modifiers so often combat goes something like they win initiative. If they roll well or get a crit a PC drops then they get annihilated in 1-2 rounds. Bonus action 8d6 or similar AoE as well. 20d6 action AoEs come online. DCs are approaching 20.

Mooks are CR2-5 i you use more power CR critters. That can take a while to grind through. So 5E advantages of faster combat kind of goes away.

 

[Minigiant]

People are missing out. Tier 3 is absolutely a sweet spot for 5e play.

Tier 3 is the sweet spot for players and DMs willing to let go the reigns and their characters.

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[Not a Decepticon]

People are missing out. Tier 3 is absolutely a sweet spot for 5e play.

Agreed. Too bad people don't play in it.

Not really. Traditionally its 3-7 or 3-8 and 5E keeps that tradition going.

Shadow of the Demon lord has a point cutting the levels in half.

You get the second attack 1 level earlier, but you miss out on 1 ASI, and action surge and the really strong fighter subclasses until way later. Most fighter subclasses are way stronger than the warpriest.

Are they? I do not see it honestly.

You can get guidance with an origin feat then the tactical mind + guidance already happens level 2 and also other people can cast guidance.

But I don't want to waste my feat on Guidance and I don't want to rely on someone else constantly doing it for me.

Level 5 your action surge only gives +1 attack, where pure fighter would bring 2.

You are already making 3 attacks, is it a loss really?

Also there is not only GWM there is also polearm fighting which also brings a minor action attack (and also a reaction attack).

Polearm Master bonus action for 1d4 is not as good and it locks you on specific weapon type. maybe I don't want to play a polearm build?

I really cant see me ever doing this.

Your loss, what build would you bring if I am bringing that one to the table then?

 

[Minigiant]

Agreed. Too bad people don't play in it

Because people start at level 1 or 3.

A great set up is when the king or duke assembles a team, that sort if thing works best at level 9 or so. So can start with pure or multiclassed PCs with the modus operendi fleshed out.

I think par of the problem with Tier is that it takes so long to get there and PCs morph how their class work at around level 10-11.

But if you start at 8-9, you can spend some levels learning you Tier 2 stuff while obsolete and transitioning Tier 1 spells to support. Then you get into Tier 3.

It think this is where War Cleric shines. War Clerics are great for multiclassing into Martials. But they are clunky until you get to Martial5/Cleric3 or Cleric6/Martial2.

 

[Not a Decepticon]

Because people start at level 1 or 3.

The problem is that overwhelming majority of published adventures, 1st or 3rd party, and advice on runnign campaigns is for level 1 or 3 games. I do not think there is single level 5+ adventure published in OSR scene either.

 

[Minigiant]

The problem is that overwhelming majority of published adventures, 1st or 3rd party, and advice on runnign campaigns is for level 1 or 3 games. I do not think there is single level 5+ adventure published in OSR scene either.

Also because Tier 3 campaigns are best as psuedo-sandboxes where you have a set of themed encounters a DM can snag to throw at the PCs depending on what the players decide to go.

I think only 4e pushed this and made creating mid level encounters dumb easy.

 

[Zardnaar]

Also because Tier 3 campaigns are best as psuedo-sandboxes where you have a set of themed encounters a DM can snag to throw at the PCs depending on what the players decide to go.

I think only 4e pushed this and made creating mid level encounters dumb easy.

I suspect most games in 4E didnt reach those levels either. Abigail reason it failed was it fixed a lot of roles that weren't actual problems.

Alot of 3.5 was theory crafting espicaly prestige classes espicially high levels. To make 4E sing you need a experienced grouo with buy in imho. Thise players are rare I have maybe 1-2 across 2 groups.

Rereding 3.5 PrCs were actually optional. A DM could easily say no.

The high level thing I suspect predates 3E though. B/X and BE parts sold well. CMI did not. Same with adventures.

Most people are casuals and 3-7 is the sweet spot and most games dont hit 7 let alone 10.

Alot of people on EMworld dont appear to be actually playing anything.
We're all old, not representative and a lot are out of touch. Im self aware of that.