New Feat: Web of Steel

[Jeff Wilder]

Web of Steel [General]

You know how to use your weapon to best defensive effect, taking advantage of freedom of movement to parry and deflect blows that might otherwise land.

Prerequisite: Proficiency with readied weapon, "good" BAB.

Benefit: When armed with a one-handed weapon (or larger) with which you are proficient, and when not denied a bonus to AC from Dexterity (whether you actually have a bonus or not), you gain a +3 armor bonus to your AC. This bonus increases by +1 per 3 levels in eligible classes (i.e., any class with a "good" BAB).

Special: A starting character with an eligible class (i.e., any class with a "good" BAB) may surrender her heaviest armor proficiency and gain this feat in its place for free. (E.g., a 1st-level fighter would give up Heavy Armor Proficiency, while a 1st-level ranger would give up Light Armor Proficiency.) This may only be done at 1st character level. A fighter may select this feat as one of his bonus feats.

Intent: This feat is intended to allow the archetype of the unarmored or lightly armored true warrior, without forcing the player to voluntarily surrender a large portion of his effectiveness, and without reliance on alternate classes.

 

[the Jester]

Hm, I think it's too good for a 1st-level feat frankly.

Dodge- the baseline AC boosting entry feat- gives you a +1 dodge bonus against one enemy.

This is three times better (or more).

Also, I'd set a flat BAB prereq and a flat AC bonus. It shouldn't depend on how many levels you have; feats don't generally increase in power with level.

Web of Steel reads more like a class ability than a feat- it ties in to specific class stuff (you want to link it to good BABs)- so I'd recommend making either a new prestige class or tweaking a base class. You might look at the swashbuckler in Complete Warrior to get some ideas (or you might even just want to use it!)

 

[Nellisir]

Still think it's too good, but you're right -- I missed the armor bonus part. I'll take another swing at it in awhile.

Absolutely too good as written. Forget giving up heavy armor - with no restrictions on using this (besides when Dex is restricted), I'd get heavy armor, a heavy shield, a longsword, and crank my AC up! Full plate + heavy shield + dex (max +1) + web of steel = nonmagical AC 24. That's with a 12 Dexterity!

And I still get all my attacks, with no penalty.



Needs revision. Minimum Dex score, minimum BAB score, restriction on use (substitutes for full attack action), at least!

Cheers
Nell.

 

[DanMcS]

This (active defense based on combat skill) is what combat expertise is for.

 

[Eraslin]

I actually don't think that it's terribly overpowered, personally. Especially considering that the feat grants an armor bonus to AC. So, it wouldn't stack with any worn armor.

Though, I'd personally be more inclined to tie it to BAB rather than "levels in classes with good BAB". Maybe a prereq of +1 BAB. Then the AC increases by +1 per 3 pts of BAB. That and reducing the starting AC bonus to +2 instead of +3. I'd also add a line which removed all benefits of the feat if the character has an armor check penalty greater than zero (ie: the character's encumbered, carrying a heavy/tower sheild or non-MW light shield, or wearing any armor better than a MW chain shirt).

Just my two cents.

-Eraslin

 

[Jeff Wilder]

Absolutely too good as written. Forget giving up heavy armor - with no restrictions on using this (besides when Dex is restricted), I'd get heavy armor, a heavy shield, a longsword, and crank my AC up! Full plate + heavy shield + dex (max +1) + web of steel = nonmagical AC 24. That's with a 12 Dexterity!

No. It's an armor bonus. It doesn't stack with other armor bonuses.

 

[Jeff Wilder]

I actually don't think that it's terribly overpowered, personally. Especially considering that the feat grants an armor bonus to AC. So, it wouldn't stack with any worn armor.

Exactly. Folks seem to have overlooked that.

Though, I'd personally be more inclined to tie it to BAB rather than "levels in classes with good BAB". Maybe a prereq of +1 BAB. Then the AC increases by +1 per 3 pts of BAB.

I considered that. It doesn't really fit what I'm going for. Web of Steel is closer to Weapon Specialization, in that I really only want certain archetypes to be able to make use of it. Specifically, highly-trained combat-oriented types. Obviously WoS is more restricted than WS, but it's the same type of restriction, and I kinda like it. What you suggest is an option, though, and will probably be decided by which my players tell me is less confusing to them.

That and reducing the starting AC bonus to +2 instead of +3.

IMO that's too weak. The only players who'd take the feat are those who would play unarmored or lightly armored fighters even without the Web of Steel option. Everyone else would pass it by in favor of armor, and the whole point is to make combat-worthy non-tank true fighters.

I'd also add a line which removed all benefits of the feat if the character has an armor check penalty greater than zero (ie: the character's encumbered, carrying a heavy/tower sheild or non-MW light shield, or wearing any armor better than a MW chain shirt).

I'm not sure what the point would be, since any armor bonus better than what Web of Steel supplies already automatically means the feat gives no benefit.

 

[Jeff Wilder]

This (active defense based on combat skill) is what combat expertise is for.

There's nothing in the rules (or the spirit behind them) that prohibits two mechanics for similar functions. Just as one example, Weapon Specialization and Improved Critical both simulate increased damage due to combat skill.

 

[Jeff Wilder]

feats don't generally increase in power with level.

Of course they do. Most just do so implicitly rather than explicitly. (Most: Power Attack and Combat Expertise, e.g., explicitly increase with level.)

Since this feat is intended to replace something else which generally increases with level, but outside the feat mechanic (that is, AC) in order to do its job and remain relevant it must increase with level. (Not unlike Power Attack and Combat Expertise.)

As an aside, nobody's mentioned the hidden benefit of the feat: presumably little or no money spent on armor. I've tried to balance that -- and, to a lesser extent -- other armor-less benefits -- by increasing the bonus slowly enough that the AC it provides should always be at least a couple points less than what armor would provide, and usually substantially less.

I'd really like to see somebody make an informed attempt to break the feat. One try was made already, but it ignored the fact that armor bonuses don't stack.

 

[Eraslin]

Re: Changing the +3 to a +2.

IMO that's too weak. The only players who'd take the feat are those who would play unarmored or lightly armored fighters even without the Web of Steel option. Everyone else would pass it by in favor of armor, and the whole point is to make combat-worthy non-tank true fighters.

Fair enough. I was trying to compare with the monk's unarmored AC bonus. But, if we assume that the monk is going to crank his/her wisdom then the difference between +2 and +3 is negligable in the comparison. (+9 at +19BAB vs +8 at +19BAB)

Re: Imposing a limit on the ACP of the character while using the feat.

I'm not sure what the point would be, since any armor bonus better than what Web of Steel supplies already automatically means the feat gives no benefit.

Ah. The point in my mind has to do with visualizing the person with this feat fighting. I'm personally picturing someone who's going to have to be able to move and parry/dodge quickly. So, it would make sense that the person would have to be unencumbered. Additionally, as written, the feat would allow a character to uber-magic up a tower shield and combine the feat with its use.

So, by saying that the feat is not applicable when the character has an ACP greater than zero it prevents use while encumbered, and use while using anything better than an MW light shield. So, a character could still use a magic'd up buckler or light shield with the feat. Additionally, if the character wanted to get a +1 suit of padded armor and magic it up with some special abilities they still could. But, they couldn't magic up a suit of chain, or something, and still use the feat.

-Eraslin