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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Serendipity" data-source="post: 2420468" data-attributes="member: 18216">Why is it that whenever anyone expresses some kind of discontent with not wanting to use battle grids, miniatures, etc etc immediately there is the assumption that the individual in question clearly wants to a) change game systems b) wants to go diceless and c) really ought to admit that they are some kind of closet thespian?Face it, it really comes down to whether or not you like a lot of crunch in your game or not (for it's own sake that is - combat here is the most obvious example but hardly the only one).  I think we can all acknowledge that no two gamers have the same tastes in the rules crunch department.   If I really get into a game, I will get delve waaaaaay deep into the rules/dice/crunch of the system - if the game doesn't do it for me, well, why should I care?Lastly, if there is a gaming group that "has problems role playing" - it's not the system, it's not the amount of rules, and it's not the old role v. roll argument (again, which is pretty much how I percieve most of this thread) - some people have, again, varying degrees of taste for the "soft" (i.e. non-crunch) aspect of the game. I know from personal experience that if your group prefers the crunchy end of things, then find something about the system to fall in love with, or get another group.</blockquote>