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[rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.
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<blockquote data-quote="Enrahim" data-source="post: 9689784" data-attributes="member: 7025577"><p>Bad things that has nothing to do with the lack of skill is a bit weird. Like the extremely unskilled cook somehow getting struck by lightning every time they burn the sauce.</p><p></p><p>How many times must it be stated that drawing attention is not a problem for most of us? It is conjuring the cook that is the problem. How do we know that the failure conjures the cook? Because it say in the example that we know there would be no cook on success.</p><p></p><p>This is a relevant point that got expanded on in my conversation with [USER=6790260]@EzekielRaiden[/USER]</p><p></p><p></p><p>This doesn't make sense? We are not talking about dependencies between fictional characters at all? If you talk about why the probability of there being someone around to hear the lock picking being independent of the outcome of the lockpicking attempt the answer is that there are no obvious causal in-fiction mechanism that could connect these and hence the mind expect these to not be correlated. If the mind register that they indeed do correlate, it <em>will</em> start searching for causality mechanisms, like common cause for both events. Stopping the mind from doing so is called "suspension of disbelief" and is something we want to keep to a minimum in the kind of games many here like to play.</p><p></p><p>Ok, I think I now might have gitten sufficient understanding to have a shot at introducing a less inflammatory terminology. Instead of GM-driven or GM-centric play, I think GM-provided play covers this concept you seem to describe much better, while being much less prone for inflammatory interpretation. I think no trad GM will feel insulted by it being insinuated that they provide the toys the players play with. They will however be insulted by it being insinuated that they for instance take a driving position on <em>how</em> the players play with these toys or that somehow the play revolve around them personally rather than the player's interaction with the toys they have provided.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Enrahim, post: 9689784, member: 7025577"] Bad things that has nothing to do with the lack of skill is a bit weird. Like the extremely unskilled cook somehow getting struck by lightning every time they burn the sauce. How many times must it be stated that drawing attention is not a problem for most of us? It is conjuring the cook that is the problem. How do we know that the failure conjures the cook? Because it say in the example that we know there would be no cook on success. This is a relevant point that got expanded on in my conversation with [USER=6790260]@EzekielRaiden[/USER] This doesn't make sense? We are not talking about dependencies between fictional characters at all? If you talk about why the probability of there being someone around to hear the lock picking being independent of the outcome of the lockpicking attempt the answer is that there are no obvious causal in-fiction mechanism that could connect these and hence the mind expect these to not be correlated. If the mind register that they indeed do correlate, it [I]will[/I] start searching for causality mechanisms, like common cause for both events. Stopping the mind from doing so is called "suspension of disbelief" and is something we want to keep to a minimum in the kind of games many here like to play. Ok, I think I now might have gitten sufficient understanding to have a shot at introducing a less inflammatory terminology. Instead of GM-driven or GM-centric play, I think GM-provided play covers this concept you seem to describe much better, while being much less prone for inflammatory interpretation. I think no trad GM will feel insulted by it being insinuated that they provide the toys the players play with. They will however be insulted by it being insinuated that they for instance take a driving position on [I]how[/I] the players play with these toys or that somehow the play revolve around them personally rather than the player's interaction with the toys they have provided. [/QUOTE]
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[rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.
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