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[rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.
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<blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 9700001" data-attributes="member: 6785785"><p>If the thief succeeds on the roll and opens the lock successfully, then the cook is either not there because she wasn't brought by the sound, or is there but unaware of the thief opening the door. </p><p></p><p>I haven't explained why the thief becomes a keystone cop because I haven't said that they would. I've said that's a silly way to resolve the matter. If you choose to do so, be my guest, but I wouldn't do that. To me, a thief potentially making noise while picking a lock and attracting attention is a perfectly reasonable thing to happen. </p><p></p><p>For some reason, you don't think it's reasonable... but at this point I don't know if you'll ever get it, Max. We may just be at that point where we have to shrug and accept that. I don't think that anything I've advocated for to make the scenario with the thief and the cook work has been nonsensical... quite the opposite. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Max, it's not about the status of the characters' lives. It's telling the GM what to be thinking about when he makes decisions.</p><p></p><p>The same way you might get to a point where you need to make a ruling in D&D and you think "how can I handle this as a neutral arbiter" the principle is telling a GM of Apocalypse World to think "how can I use this decision to make the characters' lives interesting". </p><p></p><p>I mean, here's a principle I live by: "A parent should protect their children." </p><p></p><p>Seems reasonable right? </p><p></p><p>Or if someone said this to me, should I respond with "I don't need to keep my kids safe, they're not in danger"? </p><p></p><p>Your reaction is just off. You're misunderstanding the principle and what it's for. You're reading some kind of value judgment where there isn't one. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No one is saying that the characters' lives are boring. It's saying to make sure that they don't become so. To always be considering this when you make a decision. It's a principle which is meant to guide your decision making. It's not describing the status quo of the game and telling you to go and change that!</p><p></p><p>As principles, you may not be able to be a neutral arbiter and also make the characters' lives not boring when making a decision. Look at the cook example. Your neutral arbiter principle leads you to simply have the lock pick attempt fail, and now the character needs to find another way into the house or else give up. </p><p></p><p>My principle of making the characters' lives not boring leads me to make something happen on the failed attempt... hence the introduction of the cook. That's not me being neutral... that's me making a move that complicates matters for the character. I want to see what they do now.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="hawkeyefan, post: 9700001, member: 6785785"] If the thief succeeds on the roll and opens the lock successfully, then the cook is either not there because she wasn't brought by the sound, or is there but unaware of the thief opening the door. I haven't explained why the thief becomes a keystone cop because I haven't said that they would. I've said that's a silly way to resolve the matter. If you choose to do so, be my guest, but I wouldn't do that. To me, a thief potentially making noise while picking a lock and attracting attention is a perfectly reasonable thing to happen. For some reason, you don't think it's reasonable... but at this point I don't know if you'll ever get it, Max. We may just be at that point where we have to shrug and accept that. I don't think that anything I've advocated for to make the scenario with the thief and the cook work has been nonsensical... quite the opposite. Max, it's not about the status of the characters' lives. It's telling the GM what to be thinking about when he makes decisions. The same way you might get to a point where you need to make a ruling in D&D and you think "how can I handle this as a neutral arbiter" the principle is telling a GM of Apocalypse World to think "how can I use this decision to make the characters' lives interesting". I mean, here's a principle I live by: "A parent should protect their children." Seems reasonable right? Or if someone said this to me, should I respond with "I don't need to keep my kids safe, they're not in danger"? Your reaction is just off. You're misunderstanding the principle and what it's for. You're reading some kind of value judgment where there isn't one. No one is saying that the characters' lives are boring. It's saying to make sure that they don't become so. To always be considering this when you make a decision. It's a principle which is meant to guide your decision making. It's not describing the status quo of the game and telling you to go and change that! As principles, you may not be able to be a neutral arbiter and also make the characters' lives not boring when making a decision. Look at the cook example. Your neutral arbiter principle leads you to simply have the lock pick attempt fail, and now the character needs to find another way into the house or else give up. My principle of making the characters' lives not boring leads me to make something happen on the failed attempt... hence the introduction of the cook. That's not me being neutral... that's me making a move that complicates matters for the character. I want to see what they do now. [/QUOTE]
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[rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.
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