Readied action question

[DemonAtheist]

ok

lets suppose that I am fighting a caster and a fighter, and i win initiative. I move flanking the fighter, and ready a move action if the caster begins a spell.

when the caster spells away, she isnt threatened so she should not cast defensively. i take my readied action to move up to her.

do i get an attack of opportunity to interrupt the spell?

would i have to do a bluff check before (to psych out the caster that i wasnt going to attack her, but was readying myself against the fighter)?

if it turns out the fighter had higher initiative than the caster and attacks me, can i use the readied action against his attack instead (having previously declared what my intent was)?

thankee

 

[Hypersmurf]

do i get an attack of opportunity to interrupt the spell?

No. From the SRD:

"You only provoke attacks of opportunity when you begin casting a spell, even though you might continue casting for at least one full round."

He begins casting. He is not threatened, so no AoO is provoked.

Your readied action triggers - you move over adjacent to him.

His interrupted action continues - he finishes casting the spell.

You need to be threatening him when he begins casting to receive an AoO.

if it turns out the fighter had higher initiative than the caster and attacks me, can i use the readied action against his attack instead (having previously declared what my intent was)?

Absolutely not.

You can only take your readied action in response to the condition you declared ("the wizard casts a spell")... and only the action you declared.

-Hyp.

 

[reiella]

No. From the SRD:

"You only provoke attacks of opportunity when you begin casting a spell, even though you might continue casting for at least one full round."

He begins casting. He is not threatened, so no AoO is provoked.

Your readied action triggers - you move over adjacent to him.

His interrupted action continues - he finishes casting the spell.

You need to be threatening him when he begins casting to receive an AoO.

-Hyp.

Hmm, not too sure I agree there.

You can ready a standard action, a move action, or a free action. To do so, specify the action you will take and the conditions under which you will take it. Then, any time before your next action, you may take the readied action in response to that condition. The action occurs just before the action that triggers it. If the triggered action is part of another character?s activities, you interrupt the other character. Assuming he is still capable of doing so, he continues his actions once you complete your readied action.

The interuption clause comes into play with 'multi-part' actions (such as Charge) I had thought, but it also explicitly states that the readied action occurs before the action that triggered it... So you would, technically be threatening him 'before' he started to cast.

Of course, that may also just me be my over literal interpretation of readied actions acting up again.

 

[Hypersmurf]

The interuption clause comes into play with 'multi-part' actions (such as Charge) I had thought, but it also explicitly states that the readied action occurs before the action that triggered it... So you would, technically be threatening him 'before' he started to cast.

Which would mean that a Readied action "I hit him with my sword if he casts a spell" would never actually force a concentration check... because your attack would occur when he wasn't casting. He'd take damage... and then, now that your readied action is over, he'd cast his spell with no chance of losing it.

For concentration checks via readied attacks to make any sense, the readied action must take place after casting has begun (otherwise how did the action trigger? If he's not casting, the conditions haven't been met!), but before it completes.

-Hyp.

 

[jgsugden]

There is a contradiction. The rules specify that the triggerred action takes place before the triggerring action, but it also specifies that the triggerred action interrupts the triggerring action.

Because of the conflict, we must turn to common sense. Common sense follows the High-for-a-Smurf analysis: In order for there to be something to interrupt, the triggerring action must begin before the triggerred action takes place.

If you want to disrupt the spell, you need to ready an attack, not a move.

 

[Pax]

Replace "takes place" with "resolves", and the statement again makes perfect sense. IOW, "the triggerred action resolves before the triggerring action" ...

 

[Hypersmurf]

In order for there to be something to interrupt, the triggerring action must begin before the triggerred action takes place.

It's fundamental to the "You can Trip with the Stand from Prone AoO" position.

-Hyp.

 

[reiella]

Replace "takes place" with "resolves", and the statement again makes perfect sense. IOW, "the triggerred action resolves before the triggerring action" ...

Hehe, actually, I think that would muddy it further. As my initial read of that implies that the readied action starts and finishes completely before the triggering action . Now, if it just stated flatly that the readied action interupts the triggering action (with clarification that unless elsewise impeded, the triggering action will still occur), with the readier's initiative being treated as on the same 'count' as the trigger, yet still before it.

Anycase, net result, it's again my overly literal interpretation of the rules being applied again (to a fault ). Fun sidenote, for the example given in the 3.0 PH to make sense, it has to work in the way Hyp describes , but that didn't mean too much to me either (given that examples in the 3.0 ph had a bit of a history of not being Accurate).

 

[D+1]

lets suppose that I am fighting a caster and a fighter, and i win initiative. I move flanking the fighter, and ready a move action if the caster begins a spell.

when the caster spells away, she isnt threatened so she should not cast defensively. i take my readied action to move up to her.

do i get an attack of opportunity to interrupt the spell?

No. You can ready a standard action. If you want to move as that action then you move. When your action is triggered it becomes your turn, adjusting your initiative from what it was to just prior to that of the trigger. Look at it this way: on your turn you sacrifice some of your privalege to act NOW in order to set a trigger for a specific, standard action later instead. The trigger occurs. You adjust your initiative to fit prior to the initiative of the currently acting character and it becomes your turn. You take your single, standard action. It becomes their turn again so that they can finish what they started - if they WANT to and still can do so - but there's nothing then preventing that caster from deciding to cast defensively instead of normally.

When it's your turn you decide what to do NOW, you are not committed to doing what you declared last round or the like. She doesn't even have to cast standing right there - she can take a 5' step back and cast rather than doing so defenisively. She can turn and flee. She can do whatever she wants to do NOW.

would i have to do a bluff check before (to psych out the caster that i wasnt going to attack her, but was readying myself against the fighter)?

Well, if you do it as you stated you CAN'T attack her immediately anyway - you ready ONE standard action. You can move, you can attack. Either is a standard action, but you can't do both. If she is then foolish enough to stand her ground and cast normally - AoO away to your hearts content.

if it turns out the fighter had higher initiative than the caster and attacks me, can i use the readied action against his attack instead (having previously declared what my intent was)?

You don't get to attack him either. You moved and readied a move. That's it for you in that round unless and until your readied action is triggered. Then you take your readied move. You get no attacks at that point unless an AoO comes along AFTER you've done your readied move.

 

[Hypersmurf]

When your action is triggered it becomes your turn, adjusting your initiative from what it was to just prior to that of the trigger.

Actually, it doesn't "become your turn". If the trigger comes up, you take the action, but it is "after your turn" and it is "before your next turn".

Your initiative changes... but it changes after your readied action is completed.

The readied action is taken outside of your turn.

She doesn't even have to cast standing right there - she can take a 5' step back and cast rather than doing so defenisively. She can turn and flee. She can do whatever she wants to do NOW.

She's already initiated the Cast a Spell action, though - it's what triggered your readied action. She can't take back that standard action and make a full-round Withdraw action instead; if she weren't casting a spell, your readied action would never have come up.

She could perhaps abort her casting (losing the slot) and take a move action, if she has a move action left over.

-Hyp.