Skill/Save "Take Character Level" House Rule Concept

[Knightfall]

Ok, everyone knows you can Take 10 or Take 20. Yet, the restriction is that you can't do these things while under stress. (Simple explaination.)

Now, here's an idea. What if a character could "Take Character Level" while under stress. Thus, a 8th level rogue could "Take 8", while a 15th level fighter could "Take 15". Of course, the maximum would be 20.

Opinions? Concerns? Threats?

Cheers!

KF72

 

[reiella]

Hmm, I think it'd be a very high powered rule ... once you're level 10.

If you cap it at (level / 2) instead (max 10), it still be a problem with the Value/Worth of Skill Mastery and related Class Features, but long as you control/adjust the appropiate PrCs, it just leaves Skill Mastery, which ime rogue's almost never take past the initial 'I wanna tumble easy', and even then, they can usually 'take 1' and success their DC 15 roll (by that point).

Allowing it to go over a "Take 10" option results in effective 'time compression" in most tasks, and too much of a power ramp up for my tastes.

 

[Prothall]

Intriguing, but it does seem to break up under examination. And Reiella, why have a max of ten if you can take ten anyway without the rule?

 

[der_kluge]

No way. Just because I might be a 20th level wizard doesn't mean I should be able to take 20 on craft(alchemy) if I only have 1 rank in that.

 

[JimAde]

Intriguing, but it does seem to break up under examination. And Reiella, why have a max of ten if you can take ten anyway without the rule?

It's for situations when you can't take 10 normally (like combat). So, for example, if you're a 8th level rogue and you want to Tumble through your enemy's threatened area, you just say "I'll take level." You don't roll, you just add 8 to your Tumble modifier and if it's good enough (presumably in this case it is) you succeed. I think it's an interesting idea, but it means that medium-to-high level characters will almost never bother with Tumble rolls, since the DCs are fixed. Other checks with fixed or predictable DCs will suffer the same fate.

If that's the flavor you want it could work well to show that the character is cool under fire.

 

[JimAde]

No way. Just because I might be a 20th level wizard doesn't mean I should be able to take 20 on craft(alchemy) if I only have 1 rank in that.

You can do that with the regular rules. You just get a final result of 21, and are assumed to fail a lot. This is for situations where you are under stress and want to have an average performance (for you).

With reiella's suggestion of level/2 instead of level, it means that a 20th level character can always take 10. If I was a 20th level character, I'd be pretty calm under fire, too

The thing I don't like about it is, as I said, I think it would get used too much. It would remove some of the "fog of war" that combat and similar stressful situations should provide.

 

[reiella]

Intriguing, but it does seem to break up under examination. And Reiella, why have a max of ten if you can take ten anyway without the rule?

JimAde responded why . Under stress isn't normally possible for Take 10 except for Skill Mastery benefits.

I can see it working if you're in a "High Powered" Skill-focused game, just expect needing more than 'some' adjustment to account for some of the more troubling 'take 10 under stress' problems, Tumble most specifically.

I could also go with it in a game where I didn't want to 'clutter' the playing field with die rolls for 'skill checks'.

I would never allow it for Saving Throws however.

 

[Gadodel]

*looks at idea*

*steals it*

 

[Knightfall]

Wow, I got more of a response on this than I thought I would. Considering it was an "off the cuff" suggestion, I didn't know if it would have any appeal.

Perhaps it should only be for skills that directly relate to combat like tumble or jump. That way it wouldn't unbalance everything.

Just a thought...

Anyway, I'm off to buy Frost & Fur by MonkeyGod.

Cheers!

KF72

 

[Squire James]

Forgive me if I'm start with the blindingly obvious... the mathmatical part of my mind demands it!

"Taking 10" represents the best someone can get without taking a risk. Current events might alter the situation so that any use of a skill is a risk (representing the times when taking 10 is not possible). Therefore, I consider any game mechanic where someone functions better under stress without risk is an unbalanced one.

If you desire a "no risk stress" value for a skill check, and you decide character level should be the determining factor, you should determine what you expect to be the maximum level of the campaign to be. If you expect the campaign to end shortly after someone reaches level 10, then "take character level" seems a reasonable mechanic. If you expect "low-epic" characters (the game ends with characters in low-to-mid 20's), then "take half character level" seems reasonable. If you expect "high epic" characters, consider capping the ability at level 20, or just shrug and figure everyone's unbalanced in the level 26-40 range anyway...

In any case, make this mechanic clear before a rogue gets the chance to select Skill Mastery. Of course, you can make it useful again by letting Skill Mastery add +2 to the "no risk stress" checks. If the "no risk stress" value exceeds 10, allow normal "take 10" checks to use this threshold as well.