summoning problem- need help

[alsih2o]

a character in one of my campaigns is using a lantern archon with its 'teleport without error' ability to deliver messages back to a church he visited once.

if this is possible it seems that every church in the world would be in constant communication with one another.

can anyone find a hole in this? am i the only the only one who has a problem with this?

all help is a ppreciated, cheerio and all that

 

[Caliban]

Is the character able to give a "reliable description" of the church to the archon? If he isn't, then the archon won't have enough information to teleport there.

You could rule that visiting the church once is not enough to give a reliable description.

But other than that, it sounds like his idea would work. The core rules don't really take into account how spells might affect things outside the confines of a normal adventure or combat.

 

[alsih2o]

well caliban, even though that is exactly what i DON'T want to hear, i appreciate the answer

 

[city-states]

Hmm... tricksy. Another interesting side effect of the world of fantasy. Clerics are very easily in contact with each other (well if they can cast 8th level spells...) Maybe this is a closely guarded power of the church and they don't allow for your casual messaging (or charge outrageously for it).

Lantern archons can <i>teleport w/o error</i> at will and have a permanent <i>tongues</i> yet they are limited by the duration of the summons. At maximum that is 20 rounds (more if extended). That can give them between approx. 6 seconds to 2 minutes of conversing time, barring any metamagic. This is to both receive and to transmit their message... can lantern archons hold items? If so they might give it a scroll with a message and use it like an extraplanar carrier pigeon and save some time for long messages.

Heh... come to think of it I'd make the caster describe the place so much that most of the duration of the spell would elapse. An archon is an extraplanar entity and may not be entirely familiar with the local geography. "Oh, you meant <b>that</b> octagonal church by the small stream with the symbol of Pelor above the door? How was I to know you didn't mean the one in the twenty third plane of Aganthus?"

Also, with the limited time it is possible that unless there is an agreed upon way to receive messages the archon may just wander about looking for someone to tell until the spell lapses. Assuming he runs into at least some minor clergy the time allowed for the archon to tell his story is pretty short but still a useful application of the <i>summon monster IV</i>.

Actually... the spell just duplicates the effects of a <i>sending</i> more or less. <i>Sending</i> is a 4th lvl cleric (5th lvl sor/wiz) spell that send a short messsage to a recipient unfailingly (well except across planes). The archon has more chance for failure if you can't describe the place well enough or possibly if someone isn't handy to receive the message. I'd be a little rough on using the summons this way since it cuts down on the usefulness of <i>sending</i> especially for sorcerers and wizards who get <i>summon monster IV</i> a level earlier than <i>sending</i>. Clerics would probably just use sending for short messages instead. Unless they didn't know who they were sending the message to or were really pressed for time.

Interesting... only characters who can cast the lawful and good type spells can pull this trick.

 

[city-states]

Pardon the html tags... also I wanted to amend the "8th level spells" to 4th level spells!

 

[Dash Dannigan]

Hmm, limited use really, again mostly due to duration. A 10th level cleric could summon the lantern archon for 1 minute and that may be enough time to describe the location in accurate detail, provide a brief message, and deliver this brief message. Of course such a description would need to be "detailed" as many churches of the same diety would have similar aspects. It would help if an individual was waiting in a room and expecting a scheduled message so the Lantern can teleport with greater ease.

Not a bad idea, only useful for contacting mid-low in power churches. Most diety churches that are powerful enough/lots-O-gold are built with permanent wards that prevent teleportation I'd imagine.

If the PC goes through all the trouble to set-up a reliable line of communication this way there is no trouble with this use. Keep in mind though that duration is very short especially at low level and would not likely be able to be useful at all in delivering a message besides a two or three word message.

I wouldn't worry about it much. I'd only let a PC do it if they are at the church when they think of it, so they go through the trouble of memorizing the details. If not, Wisdom check baby to get an accurate enough recall. Say between DC 10-15 depending upon the uniquness/run-of-the-mill church.

if this is possible it seems that every church in the world would be in constant communication with one another.

Well many of the Chuches of the same diety ARE in fact in communique with one another on a regular basis or at least they should be if they are of a coherent organization. If not, then the churches WOULDN'T contact one another because they disagree with policy, etc or do not wish to. Simple as that.

Now again, this use for the Lantern Archon won't be very useful for these churches to communicate due to the duration, only short messages may be sent in this manner. Unfortunately Lantern Archons won't be able to carry back a written message due to the lack of arms/hands, nothing to hold a note with. A Hound Archon on the other hand could do so.

Its a rather creative alternative for emergency communique though and I wouldn't get in a bunch about it mate, seems reasonable enough as long as apply the realistic limits to the spell according to the short duration, accurate description, and no-arms/no-note carrying capacity.

Cheers!

 

[Caliban]

The real problem is that the lantern archon can transport up to 50 pounds of objects when it teleports. You can send magic items, books, supplies, lengthy written messages, etc.

Lack of hands isn't an issue, it just needs to be touching the object. Resting on a chest and then teleporting would take the chest and it's contents.

 

[alsih2o]

The real problem is that the lantern archon can transport up to 50 pounds of objects when it teleports. You can send magic items, books, supplies, lengthy written messages, etc.

Lack of hands isn't an issue, it just needs to be touching the object. Resting on a chest and then teleporting would take the chest and it's contents.

precisely, the duration is nearly meaningless, 50 lbs allows the critter to carry many books, much less a small note...

 

[Stalker0]

precisely, the duration is nearly meaningless, 50 lbs allows the critter to carry many books, much less a small note...

Which is why summoning is cool

Would you not expect allied churches to be in communication with each other?

 

[nharwell]

If you think this might be difficult, how do you deal with the effects of spells like divination, commune, and planar ally? Think of how churches would operate if they had DIRECT communication with their god -- a much greater effect, I think, than simply being able to magically communicate with other churches.