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[jian]

You and Emily perhaps need to read Murray, as your claim that no one used the word slave in a translation before Emily is not true. I could point you to Book 17 between 311 and 324 and there are others.
Butler also uses the words slave and slavery.
I could indeed go on if you would like.


Back at you.

Nobody has ever said that Wilson was the first person to use the word slave; it was just often avoided, using other words (such as maid, servant, valet, serf, or bodyservant) much more often in earlier translations. Wilson has just used the word a lot more than in other translations, as many commentators (including Devereaux) have noted.

 

[AnotherGuy]

Nobody has ever said that Wilson was the first person to use the word slave; it was just often avoided, using other words (such as maid, servant, valet, serf, or bodyservant) much more often in earlier translations. Wilson has just used the word a lot more than in other translations, as many commentators (including Devereaux) have noted.

Servant is not exactly wrong if one knows/understands Greek, I admit it is a softening of the word but it is not wholly incorrect.
The word slave only came into being centuries later with the Greek word sklavos (σκλαβος).
The English word servant is actually older than the word slave.

I did in fact find a derivative of the word doulos in book 17 - between 311-224 (δουλιον) in the original ancient Greek text.
You were correct on that.

 

[jian]

Servant is not exactly wrong if one knows/understands Greek, I admit it is a softening of the word but it is not wholly incorrect.
The word slave only came into being centuries later with the Greek word sklavos (σκλαβος).
The English word servant is actually older than the word slave.

I did in fact find a derivative of the word doulos in book 17 - between 311-224 (δουλιον) in the original ancient Greek text.
You were correct on that.

The English word slave, of course, came into being centuries after Homer, but the concept did not, and it’s pretty undebatable that doulos and dmos meant slave, as did the Latin servus (derivation of the English word serf, even though serfs weren’t exactly chattel in the same way that servi or douloi were).

Translating doulos or dmos as servant is therefore basically incorrect.

 

[AnotherGuy]

The English word slave, of course, came into being centuries after Homer, but the concept did not, and it’s pretty undebatable that doulos and dmos meant slave, as did the Latin servus (derivation of the English word serf, even though serfs weren’t exactly chattel in the same way that servi or douloi were).

Translating doulos or dmos as servant is therefore basically incorrect.

Let's Go!

EDIT: Where do you think the word servant came from?

 

[Henadic Theologian]

Are you saying that Poseidon and the Cyclops and Scylla, and the Sirens are real? I don't think you'll get much traction on that.

Of course Poseidon is real, he's among the Gods I pray to daily, I'm not a conventional literalist about myths, you study them for deeper spiritual truths, but I'm far from being the only one who prays to ancient Gods, and know they are very real, as real as you and I, more so even.

I mean we're talking about one of the first world religions here. They were worshopped on 3 continents in ancient times, amd there are still a few temples in use.

 

[AnotherGuy]

That said, The Odyssey is not remotely analogous to holy texts or scripture and was largely viewed as mythological even by those who consumed it. In the sense that it contains applicable religious sentiments and lessons it actually has a great deal more in common with Wheel of Time than you might think.

What oral tradition does or will the WoT pass down? What cultural significance do you believe the WoT has on the English speaking world? How does the English speaking world understand their role in the world better due to the WoT? etc etc

 

[jian]

Let's Go!

EDIT: Where do you think the word servant came from?

From the Latin servire, “to attend upon, to obey” which has a similar root to servus (slave) but doesn’t mean the same thing.

 

[AnotherGuy]

From the Latin servire, “to attend upon, to obey” which has a similar root to servus (slave) but doesn’t mean the same thing.

Well the word δουλεια is work, δουλεύω means I work, because in Ancient Greece - slaves participated in a great many jobs predominantly mining/agricultural but also craftsmen, tradesmen, clerical ...etc
Also in English it is common to call house/domestic slaves servants since "they serve"

But again this goes back to the angle Emily had.
Anyways we will have to disagree on this.

 

[jian]

Well the word δουλεια is work, δουλεύω means I work, because in Ancient Greece - slaves participated in a great many jobs predominantly mining/agricultural but also craftsmen, tradesmen, clerical ...etc
Also in English it is common to call house/domestic slaves servants since "they serve"

But again this goes back to the angle Emily had.
Anyways we will have to disagree on this.

The obvious difference is that your secretary or housekeeper isn’t your property, you can’t sell or buy them, or indeed sell or buy their children.

 

[AnotherGuy]

The obvious difference is that your secretary or housekeeper isn’t your property, you can’t sell or buy them, or indeed sell or buy their children.

You are using the modern concept of servant.