Two-Handed Staff feat?

[Felon]

I thought I saw that there was a feat that provided a benefit when wielding a staff with both hands. Can't find it now though. Anyone know what it is, and the source perhaps?

 

[renau1g]

There's the Staff-Fighting feat from Dragon Annual 2009 (and one of the issues) that lets you use it as a double weapon .

 

[mneme]

There are a number, but they do so via side effect, not direct effect:

Weapon Focus(Staff): When wielding a staff with two hands, get a damage bonus (including on spells).

Staff Fighting: When wielding a staff with two hands, get +1 AC, and you count as wielding two weapons/implements (letting you take Dual Implement and get the staff's damage bonus added to damage twice, two weapon fighting for another +1 damage, and two weapon defense for another +1 AC/reflex).

 

[renau1g]

I believe there's at least some debate about whether it's a double implement or not, but yeah the TWF/TWD feats are all good.

 

[abyssaldeath]

I thought I saw that there was a feat that provided a benefit when wielding a staff with both hands. Can't find it now though. Anyone know what it is, and the source perhaps?

Are you thinking of Hafted Defense in the PHB3?

 

[mneme]

Ooh, nice. So no point in getting TWD if you're wielding a staff, as hafted defense does it one better (not requiring TWF as a prereq)

 

[Felon]

Hmm. I was actually thinking there was a feat for casters using their staff two-handed (as some wizards are wont to do). Basically, an alternative to dual-implement casting.

 

[mneme]

Upthread, Felon: Yes, mechanically DI + Staff Fighting is two weapons (eg, it uses two weapon implement). But it's actually quite powerful and you're not -actually- using two weapons; you're using a single staff.
The advantages to a caster for wielding a single staff is that they can treat it like a weapon. This is useful when you want to start applying stuff that assumes you're wielding a weapon onto it, and does compete with non-weapliment two weapon implmenet stuff handilly.

However, it doesn't actually get -better- than weapliment two weapon implement stuff unless you take staff fighting and DI -- as that way you only have to buy/maintain one weapon (your staff) rather than two.

 

[renau1g]

As I mentioned earlier though, you should probably talk to your DM/referee to see their interpretation of the DI + Staff Fighting feat as many DM's (self included) I know don't rule it that way. There's a lot of information for both sides of the argument, so I just want to make you aware.

 

[Amaroq]

Hey, I'm a DM with two relatively novice players at 3rd level, one bard, one sorceress, each wielding a staff as both weapon and implement.

Can you please re-cap, maybe a paragraph each, the major arguments for and against, and break down the builds a little bit more?

I'm following, but not quite following, this discussion as I don't have the text exactly for Haft Defense, etc. I'd like to figure out and rule on this before they level up to L4 so I can either warn them (if I interpret against the player) or gently suggest to them (if I interpret generously) as L4 feats.

Thanks in advance!